new shocks/struts a must for Steeda springs?
11-11-2008, 05:55 PM
#11
4th Gear Member
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: California
Posts: 1,471
For best performance and ride quality the struts and shocks should be changed, and it does save you labor to do it together. Will the stock shocks work? Yes they will. Especially if the car is still fairly new. However as the shocks wear they will have a harder time dampening a higher rate spring set up, so eventually the shocks will need to be replaced. If you can do it up front it will save you time and money.
Gus
Gus
Hi Gus! Long time no see!
Cheers!
11-14-2008, 10:22 AM
#12
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Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: NJ
Posts: 1,496
Yes, struts and shocks fall under the term dampeners.
I know Brent and Seth over at Brenspeed and they are very knowledgeable and good guys to deal with.
As I mentioned, if you frequent the track (enen autocrossing), doing as Brenspeed recommends is a good idea. However, if your car spends 99% of the time on the street, you may not need it.
On my car for example, I have the Ultralites, stock dampeners, and Steeda billet LCA's and it rides great! Of course, ymmv.
I know Brent and Seth over at Brenspeed and they are very knowledgeable and good guys to deal with.
As I mentioned, if you frequent the track (enen autocrossing), doing as Brenspeed recommends is a good idea. However, if your car spends 99% of the time on the street, you may not need it.
On my car for example, I have the Ultralites, stock dampeners, and Steeda billet LCA's and it rides great! Of course, ymmv.
11-14-2008, 11:22 AM
#13
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: illinios
Posts: 23
Ok .. thanks everyone for the opinions.. I guess I might as well go ahead and do them. The one thing that made me think it wasnt necessary is that the steeda springs bring the car down like 1.25" or so. So that would be within the normal operating range of the shock. Thats why I was thinking it would be ok to just use the stock shocks.
11-14-2008, 12:14 PM
#15
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Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,936
While the lowering is in the same range that stock shocks and spring travel, so is anything from topped out, to on the bumpstops.....
Dampers are more important than springs for the most stable, easiest to drive fast car. Springs can help handling, but they can also hurt it if they aren't well controlled.
And it's not just a matter of the stock stuff wearing out faster (though it will) with lowering springs. It's already starting out somewhat worn out already. Think about this. When worn out the shocks can't deal with the forces they are required to. When you start with stock dampers meant to control less spring rate, and allowed to do it throughout a greater amount of travel (the springs are taller and that gives the damper more time to damp) you are basically starting out with a weak shock--basically "worn" for the requirements.
It's "ok" to use the stock dampers... if you really don't care about how the car drives or have no idea what's really good vs. poor. It's not a popular recommendation, because dampers are not as cheap as most would like. But you indeed get what you pay for, and as the miles pile on weak shocks or cheap shocks show greater and greater weakness.
Dampers are more important than springs for the most stable, easiest to drive fast car. Springs can help handling, but they can also hurt it if they aren't well controlled.
And it's not just a matter of the stock stuff wearing out faster (though it will) with lowering springs. It's already starting out somewhat worn out already. Think about this. When worn out the shocks can't deal with the forces they are required to. When you start with stock dampers meant to control less spring rate, and allowed to do it throughout a greater amount of travel (the springs are taller and that gives the damper more time to damp) you are basically starting out with a weak shock--basically "worn" for the requirements.
It's "ok" to use the stock dampers... if you really don't care about how the car drives or have no idea what's really good vs. poor. It's not a popular recommendation, because dampers are not as cheap as most would like. But you indeed get what you pay for, and as the miles pile on weak shocks or cheap shocks show greater and greater weakness.
Last edited by Sam Strano; 11-14-2008 at 12:17 PM.
11-14-2008, 02:06 PM
#16
4th Gear Member
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Buffalo, NY
Posts: 1,083
I was thinking about getting UCAs, LCAs and a rear sway before getting my dampers and rear springs. The more and more I read though, I wonder if just a set of d-specs, Roush rear springs and my panhard bar would be enough suspension work to make a good DD and call it a day?
11-14-2008, 02:32 PM
#17
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Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,936
I think anyone would be suprised by what a good set of shocks can do on their own.
I'm not easy to please, and I demand certain things from my cars. Now, you might still need or want the control arm changes to help with wheelhop (though it often goes away on lowered cars anyway). But there is no way I'd recommend a larger rear bar until you get some time on the springs and dampers you pick. Realizing what you pick effects how the car feels).
A hard driven street car should not be loose. I drive my GT everyday (almost everyday...). I'm used to cars like Z06's, my Camaro that has coil-overs, Koni's bars, etc. I think performance cars should all drive like M030 Suspension Porsches and Z51 Vettes. They should not feel like a Town Car, an empty pick up truck, or a slammed Honda.
When I'm used to performance like this (and notice the g-figures) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HGB2_yMeBPc I don't think anyone can think I'd happy with a car that handles like crap. And with that said, the car you see is a Shelby GT... springs, bars, etc. My daily driver is a Mustang GT, with a set of Koni's on it and a little better alignment. Is it the ultimate? No, but I can tell you I find it more enjoyable to drive on a daily basis, the street manners are excellent, and it rides better too. And when I do autox it vs. the Shelby, it's not as much slower as you'd think (about .5-.7 seconds on a typical 50 second course), and that's at limits way beyond what anyone can realistically see on a street, and on the very same tires.
I'm kind of in the middle of nowhere PA. But if anyone is close by, or passing through I'd be more than happy to take them for a ride in my car, and let them judge for themselves how much the dampers matter. Especially when compared back to back to a car on stock dampers.
I'm not easy to please, and I demand certain things from my cars. Now, you might still need or want the control arm changes to help with wheelhop (though it often goes away on lowered cars anyway). But there is no way I'd recommend a larger rear bar until you get some time on the springs and dampers you pick. Realizing what you pick effects how the car feels).
A hard driven street car should not be loose. I drive my GT everyday (almost everyday...). I'm used to cars like Z06's, my Camaro that has coil-overs, Koni's bars, etc. I think performance cars should all drive like M030 Suspension Porsches and Z51 Vettes. They should not feel like a Town Car, an empty pick up truck, or a slammed Honda.
When I'm used to performance like this (and notice the g-figures) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HGB2_yMeBPc I don't think anyone can think I'd happy with a car that handles like crap. And with that said, the car you see is a Shelby GT... springs, bars, etc. My daily driver is a Mustang GT, with a set of Koni's on it and a little better alignment. Is it the ultimate? No, but I can tell you I find it more enjoyable to drive on a daily basis, the street manners are excellent, and it rides better too. And when I do autox it vs. the Shelby, it's not as much slower as you'd think (about .5-.7 seconds on a typical 50 second course), and that's at limits way beyond what anyone can realistically see on a street, and on the very same tires.
I'm kind of in the middle of nowhere PA. But if anyone is close by, or passing through I'd be more than happy to take them for a ride in my car, and let them judge for themselves how much the dampers matter. Especially when compared back to back to a car on stock dampers.
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