coilovers! H&R or Eibach??
10-16-2012, 12:46 PM
#12
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: CA
Posts: 18
The R1 is much more superior coilover over the ST as it is monotube and damper adjustable. The shocks are 100% built in the USA by Eibach at their Corona, CA facility and can be easily rebuilt if needed.
10-16-2012, 01:02 PM
#13
Former Sponsor
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,936
Monotubes are cool, but not the end all to everything. First, R1's link compression and rebound together in one adjustment. R2's and KW V3's have independent adjustments for each, and that's what you want if you are going adjustable. Wanting more rebound damping does not mean you want more compression damping, and vice versa.
KW's and ST's can be rebuilt at KW in CA as well. KW having lifetime warranty, ST's having a 5 year. Eibach are 2 year coverage.
The thing is, you cannot come to a good decision based on a bunch of posts. I do this everyday, and setup cars (and sell all these brands) and I sure would like to talk to you about what you want, expect, and need before I make a recommendation.
KW's and ST's can be rebuilt at KW in CA as well. KW having lifetime warranty, ST's having a 5 year. Eibach are 2 year coverage.
The thing is, you cannot come to a good decision based on a bunch of posts. I do this everyday, and setup cars (and sell all these brands) and I sure would like to talk to you about what you want, expect, and need before I make a recommendation.
10-16-2012, 01:14 PM
#14
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: CA
Posts: 18
Monotube is everything for a car with heavy springs or a car being used on track. A larger piston surface area in the monotube design allows for much better heat dissipation. KW and ST are twin tube with predetermined cartridges inserted into various shock bodies.
I have over a decade of track experience with Tein, Koni, Eibach, KW, ST, etc. I've tested lots of suspension set ups and the Eibach coilovers are the most tuner friendly and well built of the bunch.
Take it as fact or opinion but I'm not a dealer trying to sell coilovers. Just sharing my experience.
I have over a decade of track experience with Tein, Koni, Eibach, KW, ST, etc. I've tested lots of suspension set ups and the Eibach coilovers are the most tuner friendly and well built of the bunch.
Take it as fact or opinion but I'm not a dealer trying to sell coilovers. Just sharing my experience.
10-16-2012, 01:27 PM
#15
Former Sponsor
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,936
Monotube is everything for a car with heavy springs or a car being used on track. A larger piston surface area in the monotube design allows for much better heat dissipation. KW and ST are twin tube with predetermined cartridges inserted into various shock bodies.
I have over a decade of track experience with Tein, Koni, Eibach, KW, ST, etc. I've tested lots of suspension set ups and the Eibach coilovers are the most tuner friendly and well built of the bunch.
Take it as fact or opinion but I'm not a dealer trying to sell coilovers. Just sharing my experience.
I have over a decade of track experience with Tein, Koni, Eibach, KW, ST, etc. I've tested lots of suspension set ups and the Eibach coilovers are the most tuner friendly and well built of the bunch.
Take it as fact or opinion but I'm not a dealer trying to sell coilovers. Just sharing my experience.
I've got a little experience myself, I hold 14 SCCA National Championships, setup over 20 Championship winning cars. I drive myself, I also an a very well paid instructor when I have time to teach. I even develop my own parts from time to time.
The fact is that KW V3's, which you seem to want to gloss over and focus on the non-adjustable V1's sport INDEPENDENT adjustment, where the R1's feature double acting, or linked adjustment. I think that's bad. Now Eibach does make a kit that splits them, that's the R2, not the R1... so I'm perplexed as to why you think the R1 is the way to go, that's all.
Parroting the monotube love lines doesn't hold a lot of water with me. Do they run cooler? Yep, which matters not a lick unless shock fade is a problem. They are harder to make independently double adjustable (that's why you see bottles on an R2) and that adds complexity.
And you are 100% wrong that the larger piston area somehow promotes heat dissipation. That's done because there is one metal tube separating the oil from the air, that helps with the heat. The piston area has nothing what-so-ever to do with it. And there are lots of examples of cars with lousy monotubes and/or really good twins. Corvette's come stock with mono's, and they valving sucks. I run Koni mono's on my Corvette, which are VALVED way differently than stock. And I've driven KW's on a Corvette that were also quite superior to stock as well. A number of Porsche's and all BMW's, which are excellently damped cars, come with twin tubes.
Point being the valving of the damper is much more important than twin vs. Mono. I don't much like Eibach's normal dampers. They lack rebound and generally are cheap. However, I have been pleasantly surprised by R1's and R2's. So I'm not hating on them at all. I'm saying he has options.
10-16-2012, 03:33 PM
#16
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: CA
Posts: 18
Sam, first of all, I'm sorry if my comment came off as abrasive or you felt like I was saying you were wrong. That was not my intention. However, I do see a lot of dealers on various forums saying to buy brand xyz without the experience to back it. That can sometimes be a bit intimidating for someone looking for honest feedback. I respect that you are a dealer and a true enthusiast but I'm only offering my honest opinion.
I was comparing the R1 to the ST set up based on the OPs last comment. That's it! I've had the KW V3s before switching to the Eibach R2s and the valving, ease of tuning and spring options made the Eibach kit a much better buy in my opinion. For a street car the R1 is the next cheapest option.
Monotube runs cooler because there is more oil displacement, the cooler walls the piston runs against (which you mentioned), and this because of the larger piston. I don't need to explain this to you but I think you may have twisted what my original point was.
I don't want to turn this thread into a pissing match and would like to keep it on topic.
I was comparing the R1 to the ST set up based on the OPs last comment. That's it! I've had the KW V3s before switching to the Eibach R2s and the valving, ease of tuning and spring options made the Eibach kit a much better buy in my opinion. For a street car the R1 is the next cheapest option.
Monotube runs cooler because there is more oil displacement, the cooler walls the piston runs against (which you mentioned), and this because of the larger piston. I don't need to explain this to you but I think you may have twisted what my original point was.
I don't want to turn this thread into a pissing match and would like to keep it on topic.
10-16-2012, 04:22 PM
#17
2nd Gear Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: NJ
Posts: 410
Monotubes are cool, but not the end all to everything. First, R1's link compression and rebound together in one adjustment. R2's and KW V3's have independent adjustments for each, and that's what you want if you are going adjustable. Wanting more rebound damping does not mean you want more compression damping, and vice versa.
KW's and ST's can be rebuilt at KW in CA as well. KW having lifetime warranty, ST's having a 5 year. Eibach are 2 year coverage.
The thing is, you cannot come to a good decision based on a bunch of posts. I do this everyday, and setup cars (and sell all these brands) and I sure would like to talk to you about what you want, expect, and need before I make a recommendation.
KW's and ST's can be rebuilt at KW in CA as well. KW having lifetime warranty, ST's having a 5 year. Eibach are 2 year coverage.
The thing is, you cannot come to a good decision based on a bunch of posts. I do this everyday, and setup cars (and sell all these brands) and I sure would like to talk to you about what you want, expect, and need before I make a recommendation.
10-16-2012, 04:25 PM
#18
2nd Gear Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: NJ
Posts: 410
Sam, first of all, I'm sorry if my comment came off as abrasive or you felt like I was saying you were wrong. That was not my intention. However, I do see a lot of dealers on various forums saying to buy brand xyz without the experience to back it. That can sometimes be a bit intimidating for someone looking for honest feedback. I respect that you are a dealer and a true enthusiast but I'm only offering my honest opinion.
I was comparing the R1 to the ST set up based on the OPs last comment. That's it! I've had the KW V3s before switching to the Eibach R2s and the valving, ease of tuning and spring options made the Eibach kit a much better buy in my opinion. For a street car the R1 is the next cheapest option.
Monotube runs cooler because there is more oil displacement, the cooler walls the piston runs against (which you mentioned), and this because of the larger piston. I don't need to explain this to you but I think you may have twisted what my original point was.
I don't want to turn this thread into a pissing match and would like to keep it on topic.
I was comparing the R1 to the ST set up based on the OPs last comment. That's it! I've had the KW V3s before switching to the Eibach R2s and the valving, ease of tuning and spring options made the Eibach kit a much better buy in my opinion. For a street car the R1 is the next cheapest option.
Monotube runs cooler because there is more oil displacement, the cooler walls the piston runs against (which you mentioned), and this because of the larger piston. I don't need to explain this to you but I think you may have twisted what my original point was.
I don't want to turn this thread into a pissing match and would like to keep it on topic.
10-16-2012, 04:31 PM
#19
Former Sponsor
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,936
I want it to handle well, be a good track car that can take turns and handle well (and shut up all those people who tell me mustangs cant handle) But i also want to be able to take it to the dragstrip and pull nice results. I know that this is not exactly possible to get the complete best out of both, but that is what I have in mind. I guess handling is the most important thing though
10-17-2012, 07:09 AM
#20
2nd Gear Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: NJ
Posts: 410
We can talk about spring rates, all that stuff. But you need to call me. Otherwise it's blind opinion. All Coil-overs have stiffer rates than normal lowering springs. Between that and going lower and lower, neither are things you'd want to do to a "drag" car as they hurt weight transfer. However that's what you likely don't want for your driving. So you end up having to compromise. Maybe we need to think about dampers and springs instead of a coil-over set.
