IF you own a SALEEN: 2005-2008 Extreme or Parnelli Jones - Get your DYNO SHEETS NOW!
02-17-2009, 04:52 AM
#43
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 29
im almost there, got the 305's the watts link the 08 cai and tune actually have a better clutch rst vs spec 2+, yes!. thats what i was told they are using. i just need to upgrade the heat exchanger and im good to go, also i find it a disadvantage with the 302E stroker, more stress with that stroke and thin cylinder walls cant be a good thing, the whole 302 thing is just marketing . not to mention our 281E's are steve saleen produced which i guess could in the eyes of some be adventagious.
also from what I've heard Saleen never underated their cars, but I'll get to that in a second, the real problem was that they developed all their tunes on one test mule and then when the tune encountered a variety of engines it underpreformed due to being out of spec always and a low quality tune not tested over multiple cars and occasions. this is something that can be shown by how even with cai canned tunes the cars receiving them are always worse than the test setup, some significantly if you've been to dyno days as i have, but what cai tuners do is they test lots of cars, revise their programs and make them very flexible and they base their advertised numbers on cars besides the mules that are dynoed, something saleen didn't do.
There were huge complaints about this easy to understand oversight and Saleen even went to the length of making their tune more aggressive and better developed to fix the issue on the service end and started under-rating their cars on the sales end. For example all 302 cars are rated around 620hp but 5.0 mag tested a production 302e and found it had at least between 670-700 hp on a dyno.
I don't get why everyone always loves to hate everything they own. It's easy to hate stuff for no good reason but hard to like it even with evidence. right?
Last edited by Radiating; 02-17-2009 at 09:44 AM.
02-17-2009, 05:07 AM
#44
ask doug at brenspeed what he thinks about the 302 kit and how it's just marketing and how all that extra stress is so bad. I did and i know credible information now not just **** pulled out of your ***.
also from what I've heard Saleen never underated their cars, but I'll get to that in a second, the real problem was that they developed all their tunes on one test mule and then when the tune encountered a variety of engines it underpreformed due to being out of spec always and a low quality tune not tested over multiple cars and occasions. this is can be shown by how even with cai canned tunes the cars are always worse than the test cars, some significantly if you've been to dyno days as i have, but what cai tuners do is they test lots of cars, revise their programs and make them very flexible and they base their advertised numbers on cars besides the mules that are dynoed, something saleen didn't do.
There were huge complaints about this easy to understand oversight and Saleen even went to the length of making their tune more aggressive and better developed to fix the issue on the service end and started under-rating their cars on the sales end. For example all 302 cars are rated around 620hp but 5.0 mag tested a production 302e and found it had at least between 670-700 hp on a dyno.
I don't get why everyone always loves to hate everything they own. It's easy to hate stuff for no good reason but hard to like it even with evidence. right?
also from what I've heard Saleen never underated their cars, but I'll get to that in a second, the real problem was that they developed all their tunes on one test mule and then when the tune encountered a variety of engines it underpreformed due to being out of spec always and a low quality tune not tested over multiple cars and occasions. this is can be shown by how even with cai canned tunes the cars are always worse than the test cars, some significantly if you've been to dyno days as i have, but what cai tuners do is they test lots of cars, revise their programs and make them very flexible and they base their advertised numbers on cars besides the mules that are dynoed, something saleen didn't do.
There were huge complaints about this easy to understand oversight and Saleen even went to the length of making their tune more aggressive and better developed to fix the issue on the service end and started under-rating their cars on the sales end. For example all 302 cars are rated around 620hp but 5.0 mag tested a production 302e and found it had at least between 670-700 hp on a dyno.
I don't get why everyone always loves to hate everything they own. It's easy to hate stuff for no good reason but hard to like it even with evidence. right?
02-17-2009, 04:09 PM
#45
1st Gear Member
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: CA
Posts: 124
OK, when I first read that I thought you were dissing the 302, but now I'm not so sure. So, what did Doug say about the engine? Good, or bad?
The 5.0 article I read had the S302E coming out at pretty well spot on with Saleen's estimates. Still a few miles before mine is run-in, but then I will be making a bee-line for TPS's dyno to see how mine compares (its a Troy-built car, so unfortunately no dyno-sheet from Mike...).
Chris.
For example all 302 cars are rated around 620hp but 5.0 mag tested a production 302e and found it had at least between 670-700 hp on a dyno.
Chris.
02-17-2009, 05:08 PM
#46
2nd Gear Member
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: ny
Posts: 239
ask doug at brenspeed what he thinks about the 302 kit and how it's just marketing and how all that extra stress is so bad. I did and i know credible information now not just **** pulled out of your ***.
also from what I've heard Saleen never underated their cars, but I'll get to that in a second, the real problem was that they developed all their tunes on one test mule and then when the tune encountered a variety of engines it underpreformed due to being out of spec always and a low quality tune not tested over multiple cars and occasions. this is something that can be shown by how even with cai canned tunes the cars receiving them are always worse than the test setup, some significantly if you've been to dyno days as i have, but what cai tuners do is they test lots of cars, revise their programs and make them very flexible and they base their advertised numbers on cars besides the mules that are dynoed, something saleen didn't do.
There were huge complaints about this easy to understand oversight and Saleen even went to the length of making their tune more aggressive and better developed to fix the issue on the service end and started under-rating their cars on the sales end. For example all 302 cars are rated around 620hp but 5.0 mag tested a production 302e and found it had at least between 670-700 hp on a dyno.
I don't get why everyone always loves to hate everything they own. It's easy to hate stuff for no good reason but hard to like it even with evidence. right?
also from what I've heard Saleen never underated their cars, but I'll get to that in a second, the real problem was that they developed all their tunes on one test mule and then when the tune encountered a variety of engines it underpreformed due to being out of spec always and a low quality tune not tested over multiple cars and occasions. this is something that can be shown by how even with cai canned tunes the cars receiving them are always worse than the test setup, some significantly if you've been to dyno days as i have, but what cai tuners do is they test lots of cars, revise their programs and make them very flexible and they base their advertised numbers on cars besides the mules that are dynoed, something saleen didn't do.
There were huge complaints about this easy to understand oversight and Saleen even went to the length of making their tune more aggressive and better developed to fix the issue on the service end and started under-rating their cars on the sales end. For example all 302 cars are rated around 620hp but 5.0 mag tested a production 302e and found it had at least between 670-700 hp on a dyno.
I don't get why everyone always loves to hate everything they own. It's easy to hate stuff for no good reason but hard to like it even with evidence. right?
Last edited by sftdyna; 02-17-2009 at 05:12 PM.
02-19-2009, 04:03 PM
#47
5th Gear Member
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location:
Posts: 4,469
Alright everyone play nice...I have been told from some top engine builders that you should stick with the 4.6 or just buy a 302 block. Don't stroke it out. BUT Eaglestroker on this forum bought a stroker kit and he couldn't be happier. He has a couple thoasand miles on the car now and no issues. Thats what forums are for. To get ALL of the info.
02-19-2009, 08:45 PM
#48
1st Gear Member
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: CA
Posts: 124
But I am out of my depth here, and my above comments are pure hear-say. There are hundreds of stroked 302 powered Saleens out there, some putting out some serious HP. I know its early days, but have we any evidence of the engine being weak? Anyone heard of a Saleen 302 going bad? I'm pretty sure that Saleen would have done some serious testing of the engine before they put it into full scale production (simply so they didn't have a gazillion warranty claims...).
On a side note - does anyone know where the 302's were built? Or were they built in both Irvine and Troy? Its a pity that the builders don't sign their names to the engine like Ford and the 5.4's - that way I'd know who to go looking for if my 302 comes apart early!
Chris.
02-19-2009, 09:24 PM
#49
1st Gear Member
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: CA
Posts: 124
But I am out of my depth here, and my above comments are pure hear-say. There are hundreds of stroked 302 powered Saleens out there, some putting out some serious HP. I know its early days, but have we any evidence of the engine being weak? Anyone heard of a Saleen 302 going bad? I'm pretty sure that Saleen would have done some serious testing of the engine before they put it into full scale production (simply so they didn't have a gazillion warranty claims...).
On a side note - does anyone know where the 302's were built? Or were they built in both Irvine and Troy? Its a pity that the builders don't sign their names to the engine like Ford and the 5.4's - that way I'd know who to go looking for if my 302 comes apart early!
Chris.
02-19-2009, 09:58 PM
#50
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 29
first off radiating i didnt pull anything out of my a** im just repeating information given to me by a tuner considered by some to be quite knowledgeable in the area of saleens and dyno figures, as far as the 302 number being a marketing ploy this to has been discused many times before not just by me! perhaps you should speak to the engine builders on these forums who have also stated that the best stroker set up if you feel you need to stroke at all would be 298 and that some of the 302 stroke kits put unnecessary stress on the motor so where is the advantage if this is the case, also not my opinion just repeating info that has been discused before!! so pulling stuff out of my a** no sir!! but the way you have addressed this has definately made you look like one. most of us here like to act like gentlemen and help when we can, others hate for no reason!!
Here's an interesting read about the 302 being underrated:
http://www.moddedmustangs.com/forums...nderrated.html
The 5.0 magazine article isn't the one I remember reading, it must have been in a different magazine but isn't available through 5.0.
My point is that don't take info at face value, even here.