Need some suspension advise
03-18-2016, 11:06 AM
#1
2nd Gear Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Henderson, NV
Posts: 187
Need some suspension advise
16 GT Premium, 6 speed manual trans with 3:31 gears. So far with 350 miles on it, the nose comes up and the rear squats down under acceleration, and not just hard acceleration. I want to negate this pitching motion, would a set of Bilstein shocks do it, or is there another shock vendor that would do it?
What vendor cold air intake is available for the 16 5.0?
What vendor cold air intake is available for the 16 5.0?
03-18-2016, 01:31 PM
#3
2nd Gear Member
Join Date: Jul 2015
Location: TX
Posts: 150
shocks won't address that. Springs will help. Especially stiffer in the rear to help manage the loading that occurs under acceleration.
Another thing that will help are the Steeda sub-frame braces. They help stop the wheel hop and squatting.
Another thing that will help are the Steeda sub-frame braces. They help stop the wheel hop and squatting.
03-18-2016, 02:21 PM
#4
Gentleman's Relish
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: AZ
Posts: 13,090
The stiffer the suspension the less forgiving your grip will be. Just be aware of that if you're running all seasons. When the car accelerates the energy has to go somewhere, some is lost in moving the mass (rotational and linear) some is lost in the squat (weight transfer), the rest goes to friction.
If you reduce your squat, most of the energy saved from the squat will be transferred to the friction side (tire meets pavement) that means you'll more likely spin the tires a they fight for traction. If you have all seasons, good luck you'll probably have to baby it off the lights more.
If you reduce your squat, most of the energy saved from the squat will be transferred to the friction side (tire meets pavement) that means you'll more likely spin the tires a they fight for traction. If you have all seasons, good luck you'll probably have to baby it off the lights more.
03-18-2016, 05:35 PM
#5
2nd Gear Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Henderson, NV
Posts: 187
The stiffer the suspension the less forgiving your grip will be. Just be aware of that if you're running all seasons. When the car accelerates the energy has to go somewhere, some is lost in moving the mass (rotational and linear) some is lost in the squat (weight transfer), the rest goes to friction.
If you reduce your squat, most of the energy saved from the squat will be transferred to the friction side (tire meets pavement) that means you'll more likely spin the tires a they fight for traction. If you have all seasons, good luck you'll probably have to baby it off the lights more.
If you reduce your squat, most of the energy saved from the squat will be transferred to the friction side (tire meets pavement) that means you'll more likely spin the tires a they fight for traction. If you have all seasons, good luck you'll probably have to baby it off the lights more.
Thanks for the knowledgeable explanation. Until I change the Pirelli P Zero Nero 235/50-ZR18 Tires, I'll leave it as is.
03-20-2016, 04:08 PM
#6
2nd Gear Member
Join Date: Jul 2015
Location: TX
Posts: 150
Sorry, have to roll my eyes and the above half answer that sounds authoritative but misses a ton.
Squat and nose dive (where the front end of the car does down under brake), together called pitch, are caused be weight transfer between the front and rear of the car. Reducing it does not necessarily mean you are going to lose traction. In fact, reducing it massively improves the handling of your car. Why do you think cars that handle well have stiff chassis (the latest edition of STi had a ton of new weld points on its chassis to further stiffen it and improve its handling) & suspensions?
Before going further: what is your desired outcome? Just driving around town and wanting a comfortable ride? Drag racer? Road course/canyon carver? Each one has a different answer with different trade offs.
My primary focus is road course handling and canyon carving. The setup as described above (sprints, shocks, sway bars and braces) produces a car that easily handles +1LG with an acceptable ride quality around town. The addition of camber plates will allow me to further tune the handling characteristic to get rid of understeer in specific conditions. (mostly a result of my bad habits).
The car doesn't squat or nose dive. even with the POS all seasons the little bit of wheel spin off the line is minor and mostly provides grins when driving like an asshat.
As soon as I finish burning off these all seasons I'll return to the Pirelli summer tires which were much better and predictable when drifting corners.
again: what are you after?
Squat and nose dive (where the front end of the car does down under brake), together called pitch, are caused be weight transfer between the front and rear of the car. Reducing it does not necessarily mean you are going to lose traction. In fact, reducing it massively improves the handling of your car. Why do you think cars that handle well have stiff chassis (the latest edition of STi had a ton of new weld points on its chassis to further stiffen it and improve its handling) & suspensions?
Before going further: what is your desired outcome? Just driving around town and wanting a comfortable ride? Drag racer? Road course/canyon carver? Each one has a different answer with different trade offs.
My primary focus is road course handling and canyon carving. The setup as described above (sprints, shocks, sway bars and braces) produces a car that easily handles +1LG with an acceptable ride quality around town. The addition of camber plates will allow me to further tune the handling characteristic to get rid of understeer in specific conditions. (mostly a result of my bad habits).
The car doesn't squat or nose dive. even with the POS all seasons the little bit of wheel spin off the line is minor and mostly provides grins when driving like an asshat.
As soon as I finish burning off these all seasons I'll return to the Pirelli summer tires which were much better and predictable when drifting corners.
again: what are you after?
03-21-2016, 09:12 AM
#7
2nd Gear Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Henderson, NV
Posts: 187
I want to negate the pitch and just drive with spirit on the street. Negating the roll would be nice too after I negate the pitch, or take care of both issues at the same time. No track days, just spirited driving on the street when conditions for that type of driving is there.
04-06-2016, 09:32 AM
#10
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: California
Posts: 8
As already mentioned here, changing the springs will help a lot to significantly reduced nosedive and acceleration squat.
I would consider looking into springs that are progressive rather than linear. From my understanding and I may be wrong, progressive springs will keep much of the ride comfort and linear are more on the harsh side.
Steeda makes a set of progressives. It's what I have on my car, I've been happy with them.
I would consider looking into springs that are progressive rather than linear. From my understanding and I may be wrong, progressive springs will keep much of the ride comfort and linear are more on the harsh side.
Steeda makes a set of progressives. It's what I have on my car, I've been happy with them.