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Weird Vert Leak....

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Old 11-24-2006, 02:42 PM   #1
undecided.steve
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Default Weird Vert Leak....

Had very heavy rains here the last 2 days and now I've discovered a leak in my 2003 GT top, or somewhere else.
This one is very strange because water collects on the floor pan behind the passeneger seat and right at the part where the floor meets the hump and then a little into the floor pan. The sides of the hump are completely dry!

There is no water anywhere else and everything else is completely dry!
The carpet on top of the transmission hump is dry, rear seat is dry, top storage compartment is dry the carpet going up the sides of the car is dry, trunk is dry etc...

It's like somone poured a glass of water right at this one spot because I don't see/feel any water *tracks* leading to a spot where the water might be entering the car!!

It's a decent amount of water though so the leak is serious.

The rubber seals look good and I've sprayed a hose around everything and can't figure out where it's coming from.

Are there any drain holes along the sides/rear frame of the top (the black metal thing) that I could check for clogging?

The mystery is, how can a car sitting still, pool water in one spot pretty much in the middle of the car without it dripping down from the above?

Any ideas?
tia
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Old 11-24-2006, 03:11 PM   #2
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Default RE: Weird Vert Leak....

Wow yep that's a good one lol. Has it happened only once?

Next time it rains try draping a newspaper over the spot, so you can see if water "fell" from the roof down to that spot. It's really the only way water could be entering the cabin if it's happening while the car is PARKED in the rain.. I can't see water entering from the side??

Got any practical joking buddies that might just have done what you said,, opened the door & pour a cup of water in the floor? lol I knew a guy why did that at the college residence. He'd run about 5 feet of small hose under someone's dorm door & dump a bunch of wather through it, then pull the hose hose out. The guy living there would come home & see a pool of water in the middle of his floor but could NOT figure out where it came from.. ROFL!
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Old 11-24-2006, 03:29 PM   #3
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Default RE: Weird Vert Leak....


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ORIGINAL: GreyStang

Wow yep that's a good one lol. Has it happened only once?

Next time it rains try draping a newspaper over the spot, so you can see if water "fell" from the roof down to that spot. It's really the only way water could be entering the cabin if it's happening while the car is PARKED in the rain.. I can't see water entering from the side??

Got any practical joking buddies that might just have done what you said,, opened the door & pour a cup of water in the floor? lol I knew a guy why did that at the college residence. He'd run about 5 feet of small hose under someone's dorm door & dump a bunch of wather through it, then pull the hose hose out. The guy living there would come home & see a pool of water in the middle of his floor but could NOT figure out where it came from.. ROFL!
Yea it's a puzzler for sure!!
It's actually happened twice, both times very heavy rain.

I suspect that part of the underside of the carpet might be rubberized so that the water may be traveling from another part of the car to this section and not getting the carpet wet along it's path.

For all I know it could be coming in at the front and traveling because both times the car was on a slight inclin, front high.
Both times car was still as well.

I'm going to have to dry it out and then start squirting the hose at one spot at a time and see if it gets wet.

I've done some searching and people talk about drain holes but I can't seem to locate them.

I have some crazy friends but I don't think they would do this.

The newspaper sounds like a good idea.

Anyone else?


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Old 11-24-2006, 04:30 PM   #4
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Default RE: Weird Vert Leak....

Thats very odd.. my car is torn apart over at the shop .. I'll take a look back there and how everything looks under the panels ... with the verts .. the back seat sits on top of like a bucket area .. so i doubt the water came from anyfurther back than .. have you taken out your back seat to see if its leaking from that area down ?
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Old 11-24-2006, 04:44 PM   #5
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Default RE: Weird Vert Leak....


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ORIGINAL: akelemecz

Thats very odd.. my car is torn apart over at the shop .. I'll take a look back there and how everything looks under the panels ... with the verts .. the back seat sits on top of like a bucket area .. so i doubt the water came from anyfurther back than .. have you taken out your back seat to see if its leaking from that area down ?
I'd appreciate you taking a look.
I haven't taken out the back seat yet but the carpet going up the ledge to the back seat is bone dry which is what is puzzling me ?

One thing I noticed is that the transmission hump right at the back of the console, appears to have more padding under it as it goes under the console up towards the front of the car.
I'm wondering if water is somehow running under the padding there and exiting at the back where there is not as much padding?

This is real weird!
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Old 11-24-2006, 05:16 PM   #6
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Default RE: Weird Vert Leak....

if it's very heavyrain... chances are there's heavy wind too... when I take my GT hardtop to the carwash, the dryer/pressure washer forces water in through the weather stripping by the a pillar/speakers.... so I'm wondering if its just that water was forced through somewhere.... try hitting the weather stripping with a power washer and see if it sneaks inside...
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Old 11-24-2006, 05:50 PM   #7
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Default RE: Weird Vert Leak....


Quote:
ORIGINAL: dubarado

if it's very heavyrain... chances are there's heavy wind too... when I take my GT hardtop to the carwash, the dryer/pressure washer forces water in through the weather stripping by the a pillar/speakers.... so I'm wondering if its just that water was forced through somewhere.... try hitting the weather stripping with a power washer and see if it sneaks inside...
Excellent idea!
Both times it leaked it was VERY windy outside.

It seems to pool where the front pass seat mounts to the floor and gets wetter as I go toward the hump.
It's dry by the door side, but if it's running along under something before exiting that might be what it is.

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Old 11-24-2006, 07:22 PM   #8
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Default RE: Weird Vert Leak....

Alright, I dryed up the floor and closed up the top, windows etc and got out the garden hose.
I figured I would spray one section of the car at a time, so if it did leak I could at least narrow it down.

Bottom line is I have sprayed the entire car, both as a normal shower (like real rain) and also with the hose on jet and aiming it right at every rubber seal I can find.
I sprayed the all around the cowl, windshield and the all around the trunk, windows, doors and the roof.

Result is not a single drop of water seems to be coming into the car

Trunk is bone dry as well and so is the front carpets, under the dash etc.

I read a post here:

http://www.mustangforums.com/archive...2177581-1.html

That talks about drain holes in the rear wheel well down where the piston mounts being clogged.
Supposedly the water drains from the front of the rear wheel well?

Anybody familiar with this?

I am going to take a look at this tomorrow and see if I can find anything.
A quick look UNDER the car doesn't show any drain holes but I suspect their has to be some
because the design of the top doesn't look like it is made to seal completely everywhere but to allow water to drain at certain spots.

This is really puzzling!
Any ideas?

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Old 11-24-2006, 09:23 PM   #9
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Default RE: Weird Vert Leak....

Quote:
ORIGINAL: dubarado

if it's very heavyrain... chances are there's heavy wind too... when I take my GT hardtop to the carwash, the dryer/pressure washer forces water in through the weather stripping by the a pillar/speakers.... so I'm wondering if its just that water was forced through somewhere.... try hitting the weather stripping with a power washer and see if it sneaks inside...
You really don't take a vert through the car wash. Go trade it in for a coupe! That's one of the dumbest things to do too a vert next to using a power washer on it.
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Old 11-24-2006, 10:39 PM   #10
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Default RE: Weird Vert Leak....

Here's a longshot ...

This summer I was watching out an office window at the neigbors parking lot during a really HEAVY rain! I mean wrath of god type of heavy downpour that lasted quite a while. Well, the parking lot kinda has a droop in the center of it and, the storm drains couldn't dump the rain out fast enough and. sure enough a the water flooded up, as high as the bottom of some of the cars doors! Some flood water might have leaked into one of those cars.. same could happen to you?
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Old 11-24-2006, 11:19 PM   #11
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Default RE: Weird Vert Leak....


Quote:
ORIGINAL: GreyStang

Here's a longshot ...

This summer I was watching out an office window at the neigbors parking lot during a really HEAVY rain! I mean wrath of god type of heavy downpour that lasted quite a while. Well, the parking lot kinda has a droop in the center of it and, the storm drains couldn't dump the rain out fast enough and. sure enough a the water flooded up, as high as the bottom of some of the cars doors! Some flood water might have leaked into one of those cars.. same could happen to you?

I thought of that but the 2 times it has happened (within last 2 weeks) the car was in two different spots.
The first one was actually in Vermont and the second time it was in my driveway.

Drainage is good at both spots.

The only thing common is both times the car is on a slight incline with the nose pointing up and at least in my driveway, the roadbed leans slightly to the drivers side.

Also both times the car was sitting, not being driven.

I notice there is a long thread in the 2005+ group about cars flooding inside when parked on inclines but those guys are having water entering near the front passenger side and coupes do it as well.
Looks a lot worse than my problem which is just in the rear behind the passenger seat.

I'm going to pull the rear seat tomorrow and also the speakers and see if I can find this drain hole.

Seems to me since the car leans a little toward the drivers side, water entering from around the passenger rear fender well would pool at the spot near the transmission hump. Maybe it's running along something under the seat and exiting near the hump which is why I don't feel any wetness as I go toward the door or up the carpet as it goes up the sides and under the rear seat.

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Old 11-25-2006, 05:55 PM   #12
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Default RE: Weird Vert Leak....Found The Leak!!

Alright, I spent the afternoon removing the rear seat, peeling back the rear carpet and looking.

Turns out I have TWO problems.

This post actually gave me some clues:

http://www.mustangforums.com/archive...2177581-1.html

The rear passenger foot well was soaked and also under the seat out at the very edge of the body there was a very little amount of water.
There was a lot of leaves and stuff in there, on both sides, so I cleaned it all out.

I never did find any holes like the above post mentions, but I did notice that right at the front of where the seat mounts the seam is open and you can see out to the ground.

The problem in this area is that lots of stuff is sealed with RTV from Ford so it is difficult to tell how the drainage is supposed to work.

What I noticed is that their is a little trough that runs right into the rear passenger floor pan, but there is no way for the water to get out because the open seam is about 1/8 inch high and the water can't really climb over the seam and get to the opening and drain!!!!

I simply enlarged the seam and bent the metal to guide the water out to the ground.

Now when I flood the top (I am talking about REALLY spraying A LOT), the very small amount of water that
collects in there has a place to go.
I did the same on both sides because the other side was very slightly damp, but nothing like the passenger side.

After doing this, I thought about it and reached the conclusion that this isn't a lot of water so how could it soak the carpet even after a few hours of rain?

It doesn't make sense.

So I started looking more.

I put the front end up on ramps because both times the carpet flooded the car was parked on an angle.
Sprayed my water again and WOW!!

It was coming out of the inside of the rocker panel frame (the thing with the holes in it so you can look inside) right at the edge where Ford siliconed the seems.
IOW where the rocker panel meets the floor pan and slightly above.

(you have to pull off the plastic trim to see this)

There was also water dripping out from under the car near the rear wheel, which is how it's supposed to work I guess.
It appears that the water gets channled inside this frame member and exits at the back of the car.

(BTW the plastic ground effects block everything so you can't really see from underneath)

Since the silicone was leaking, lots of water was running right into the rear floor pan.
Also there is a rubber patch over some kind of access hole that was not sealed correctly.

The other side, which does not leak, has a lot more silicone from the factory...

Bottom line, dry it all out and silicone the hell out of it......

I'm going to let it dry overnight and test tomorrow.

I'll keep ya posted
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Old 11-25-2006, 06:19 PM   #13
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Default RE: Weird Vert Leak....Found The Leak!!

Wow you should write all that into a script & send it in to CSI lol Umm can you factor a dead body into there somewhere?

Keep digging dude, the water is coming from somewhere & Captain Kirk isn't beaming it there from the future
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Old 11-25-2006, 06:46 PM   #14
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Default RE: Weird Vert Leak....Found The Leak!!

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ORIGINAL: GreyStang

Wow you should write all that into a script & send it in to CSI lol Umm can you factor a dead body into there somewhere?

Keep digging dude, the water is coming from somewhere & Captain Kirk isn't beaming it there from the future
I guess it's the engineer in me that gets me interested in the tough ones.
I'm pretty sure I have it fixed, I'll give it the garden hose test tomorrow after the silicone drys.

I wonder if the Ford factory manual lists where the various drain holes are in these things?
I know my Chevy book does.
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Old 04-30-2014, 01:46 PM   #15
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Mine is doing the exact same thing.I'll have to read your solution a few times to make sure that I understand the fix.Thank you.
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Old 04-30-2014, 01:46 PM
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