FoxbodyKid

Hey guys, i got a problem with my fox. I have a 93 lx with gt40 heads, stock valves, Alex's springs, new stock length hardened pushrods, new stock (stamped) rockers and new lifters. Yes I soaked them in oil before install. The cam is a e303 cam, and the block is rebuilt with about 1000 miles on it. It runs good and the only issue with it now is this darn ticking/rattling sound. It is definitely coming from under the valve covers. When I use one of those mechanic stethoscope it is the loudest and highest pitch on the valve covers. It is consistent with rpms, though I don't hear it over like 3k rpm cuz the exhaust is loud. I do think since the block was decked, it might need a different size pushrod, but the thing is that this noise started before the motor was rebuilt. After I did the hci, it ran with no ticking for about 3 months, then it started rattling/ticking. The oil pressure was also about 2 lbs at idle so I knew it was time for a rebuild. Fast forward, rebuild done, and the car has plenty of oil pressure (20 lbs hot idle) but the mysterious ticking sound was still there, except this time it was a lot quieter, but still loud enough to make me lose my mind. I drove it anyway, cuz I was in highschool and needed to go places and stuff. It was perfectly reliable and always ran fine, just this annoying valve train noise. About a 1000 miles after the rebuild , some lady totalled my car. Front end smushed but beyond the radiator everything fine. Talk about my dreams being crushed. Long story short, I can never give up on this car so new frame rails and now it's back on the road nearly 7 months later. While at the shop I put new stock rockers and new stock length pushrods because I discovered I put the wrong length pushrod in when I first did the rebuild. Once we get it all back together the stupid valve train just makes so much damn noise. Same as before, no difference. The rockers were torqued down at 20 lbs 3/4 of a turn past zero lash when the cylinder was at tdc. The springs are shimmed to make each spring 1.74" installed height, as the instructions say. I made sure to put the right locks in the right place (exhaust one on exhaust intake on intake) one thing the machine shop guy said something about was the coil bind, or the spring is very close to being completely compressed, but I do not know how to fix this. I asked him what the sound could be but he said it is normal with a aftermarket cam, which I don't think is true in my case lol. But he also said it isn't a lifter, which I think he's right cuz it's not a extremely loud ticking, it sounds like a dyno after you do a pull kind of. The thing sounds perfectly fine when it's cold. No ticking, quiet valve train, untill about 10 mins later damn thing sounds like a dyno machine after you do a pull. Im pretty sure it's not an exhaust leak as it's loudest from the valve covers and it's consistent on both sides. It is heard at idle up until the exhaust is too loud to hear it, but it is loudest from 2k-1.5k when engine braking. Iam so lost on this, I've read probably every ticking foxbody thread ever, I just need some help. Thanks for reading all this crap !!

wbrockstar

One thing you might do is run a compression test with the engine at operating temp.Make sure the throttle blade is fully open and the ignition is disabled.This test will tell you if the valves are all sealing completely or not.Did you buy the heads new,reman or used and if used,did you get them rebuilt when the engine was done because sticking valves can cause ticking noises?? The fact that the noise isnt present when the engine is cold,but starts up once it reaches operating temp,may indicate the metal expansion of specific components is causing the noise.<br />

wbrockstar

If Foxbodys are such pieces of **** in your opinion,what are you doing here?? Shouldnt you be on a different forum or better yet (because of your negative comment) a completely different site?? This forum,and all of the others too,is here to help fellow Mustang owners get their car problems solved.Its not here for the purpose of bashing.The 86-93 Foxbodys are some of the most well liked Mustangs ever built,so why the hate??

Buck Sergeant

FoxbodyKid, coil clearance is the distance between the valve spring coils when the valve is at maximum lift (fully open). A recommended minimum of 0.060" must exist between the coils at maximum lift. Coil bind is when the valve spring is compressed fully to the point that all of the coils are "stacked up" or in a worse case scenario touching each other. I would start out by having the valves re-adjusted. If the ticking persists, and everything else has checked out, I would suspect the valve seats were cut wrong and you are hearing the valves squeaking against the seat trying to center itself. Tell this to your mechanic and see what he has to say about the valve seats being out of spec.

mjr46

it's been taken care of, thank you

FoxbodyKid

Thanks for replying guys. Rockstar, I will have to do that. The heads are from junkyard and they had 250k miles on them when I pulled them off. I put new springs and retainers from Alex's springs, and made sure they could handle the lift the e cam and they are made specifically for gt40 heads. The vavles have only been polished by me, a drill and some of that valve grinding stuff. They looked good and seemed to seat just fine when I had them off. But other than that, the valves are original to the heads (so 250k miles on them lol.) The guy who helped rebuild the motor looked over the heads before install. And buck, if the springs where binding, would that result in like vavles hitting Pistons? Or noise from idle to 2k? That is where it is the loudest, and it isnt very noticeable at all really past that. Especially engine braking. I can hear it very slightly when I cold start it now that I listened to it again, but once it warms up it gets significantly louder. I've been able to drive this thing for about 1000 miles with this sound, and it has always started, and been reliable, just sounds like a sewing machine. I remember when I had the mech gauge, my oil pressure was about 19 hot idle and 45+ when you rev it. Is that low for a fresh rebuild? You suggest adjusting the valves. You would do this by checking pushrod length, and making sure rockers have the proper geometry? Or do you mean like the shims under the cable springs. I drove it more today as I'm trying to get trust in it again, and I have this weird feeling that I can't go past like 4k rpms. I tried today and the cel came on and it honestly just didn't feel right. Like it's losing power up top and it doesn't want to rev that high. Or maybe I'm just being paranoid my dad would tell me. Thanks again guys. I'll try to maybe post a video of the sound too.

FoxbodyKid

Here's a video of the noise. It is a little louder in person than on camera but I think the video does a good job showing the sound.

Buck Sergeant

FoxbodyKid, WOW, I love the "overlap" sound that 303e cam makes. To put everything in a nutshell, what we are talking about here is "valve train geometry." I used to teach classes on this subject and it is one of the most misunderstood components in the engine. The next least understood item is the "torque converter." What I would suggest is pull those heads, before real damage is done, and get them to a shop with a machinist who specializes in head work. As my crew chief says, "every extra dollar you have should be going into head work." If you take the heads to a speed shop enquire about the qualifications of whoever assembles/modifies their heads. Remember, you can have all the power in the world, but it is the heads that makes it all work. If money isn't to much of a problem, Bill Mitchell, Dart, Ford and many others offer great fully assembled heads. Presently, I am using AFR heads in all my stroker motors. Let me know your decision.

mjr46

check the valve cover baffles and make sure they aren't hitting the rockers, sometimes they need to be clearanced

FoxbodyKid

Buck and mjr thanks for reply. I have checked the valve covers and they have no signs of wear or contact. Iam beginning to think that it must be oil pressure related. I was told that oil galley plugs can come out or easily forgotten in the rebuild process and cause the lifters too not get enough oil. I feel like this is likely my problem, especially since hot idle oil pressure is only like 18 lbs. Just seems a little low for a rebuild. I did think it was the rockers, but I have taken the valve covers off and redone the rockers multiple times, and they never had any metal shavings, no damage to the pushrods or valves at all and Ive put about 1500 miles on it. I really don't want to pull the heads as I just spent a month trying to get this thing back on the road, and I'm almost 100% certain that the rockers are right and the preload and all that is right. Is it possible for oil galley plugs to like just fall out one day? I seen videos where people thread them in so they don't come out. If this happened would it shred my lifters and cam? Or could it get enough oil to still be functional but just noisy as hell? This is the biggest mystery of my life.