blk08

Getting ready for my first track day, Pocono 7/18. Any advice, suggestions? What should I be expecting in terms of track time and how hard to you really get to push your car in HPDE 1?

Car is bone stock what tire pressure should I run?

Thanks

Norm Peterson

Don"t be concerned with how hard you"ll get to push the car on your first time out. Concentrate instead on learning how to properly drive it, on where the "line" is, and on following it. Your instructor won"t be impressed by speed anyway; it"ll be"smoothness", control, and following directionthat"ll do that. That should keep you busy enough on your first track day. Keep in mind that people do put a wheel or wheels "off" or "go agricultural" from time to time. Don"t do that on your first day.

I saw a "first impressions" post by somebody on another forum that contained this little piece of advice - as his own decision he left the tranny in 4th going around the whole course as a way of minimizing distraction. At least for the first session. His instructor was impressed. You absolutely want to convince your instructor that you can keep the "red mist" at bay.

You"ll probably end up driving reasonably hard, BUT YOU WILL NOT BE RACING!!!!!

I imagine that any tire pressures suitable for auto-X would be appropriate. I used to run pure street tires at somewhere between 37f/33r and 40/37 (hot) in a car of generally similar size and weight in CP. I"d tend more toward the lower end if only so that any bumps you encounter with those OE shocks won"t disturb the car as much. Don"t get too distracted with vehicle stuff. Right now, it"s a good bit quicker/faster than you are at either auto-X speeds or up towards 3 digit speeds. It"s you that has to catch up to it.

Like for auto-X, bring supplies. You"ll be there all day, and I don"t know what"s available on site. Adequate or required clothing, fluids, food, a salty snack,sunscreen, a chair, an umbrella for protection against either too much sun or rain, anything else you think you might want or need. A box or a milk crate to put it all in during the day. I always bring a tire pump and a torque wrench (for tightening/checking lug nut torque) to auto-X.


Norm

Argonaut

Pocono on the 18th...LOL. I will be there on the 19th. I live in Harrisburg, where are you from? Prepare to get addicted, its unbelivebly fun!

You will probably getfour 30min sessions with an instructor in the right seat. You can push the car as hard as you feel comfortable with. Pocono is a great track to learn on because it has no elevation changes, nice grass infieldand lots of run off. You will not be able to push the car too hard because of your stock brakes. Depending on how comfortable and aggressive you are this may or may not be a problem - the stock pads can quickly melt and the DOT3 fluid boil whenstopping a 3600lb car from110 to 40-50MPHlap-after-lap(depending on which course you are on. the north course for example has a long straight followed by a sharp right hander.) Something to be aware of. Between now and then you may want to consider a brake upgrade: replace the fluid with a DOT4 like Motul or ATE superblue, replace at least the front pads with something like Hawk HP+ or better. Im using Hawk HT-10 front, HP+ rear and have no brake fade. If you contact 'sam strano' he can probably get these to you in a few days, plenty of time to prep the car.

Make sure you have fresh oil in the car.

Im assuming you are on the stock 235/55/17 Pirellis? They have a high sidewall and will need some extra pressure to keep the tire from rolling over onto the side. Id bump them up a couple lbs. Take a tire guage with you. After the first session look at the junction between the tread and the sidewall, if any scrubbing shows on the sidewall they are rolling over and youll need a bit more pressure. Your instructor will help you with this.

Im always looking for guys to head to the track with. If you like itand want to do more let me know. Ive got a list of just about every HPDE type event for all the tracks in a 200 mile radius of Harrisburg and will be participating in several between now and november: summit point, watkins glen, beaver run, pocono, NJMSP

Sam Strano

The biggest issue is brakes. Your day is ruined if you can't stop, becaue you can't drive hard. And you might not find out your brakes are cooked until it's too late.

Now, the first time you are on a track, it's not generally "that fast". The instructor doesn't want to die, you don't want to wreck and it's intimidating. However, because of the close course and such, even taking it easy can result in some big speed and stopping that's repeated lap after lap. And as you gain seat time and confidence you'll only be harder on the brakes.

The only thing you *need* to do to the caris to get the brakes done. At first it might seem like overkill, but it's not. Of course good oil, topped up and all is only wise.

Of course, don't forget your brain. Water, your AAA card (just in case), etc. Norm hit on those things pretty well.

And yes, I can generally get pads and fluid to you pretty damned quick, but time is a wasting.

FWIW, the pads and fluid Argonaut uses (and I recommended to him) can be found here: http://www.stranoparts.com/searchbym...&ModelID=5 We also have stainless steel brake lines too, but they aren't yet on the website.

Argonaut

Oh yea - two more thoughts:

- Turn off traction control for two reasons: you need to learn how to control the rear end, not the computer. IF you do slip the rear end with TCS on, its going to be tapping the rear brakes for you...good way to wear out those pads.

- When you come into the paddock from a session - stop the car and leave it in gear. Do Not put the E-brake on. You don't need the rear pads frying on the very hot rotors.

RodeoFlyer

fluids - for the car

fluids for YOU


I would definitely at the very least change out your brake fluid. maybe throw lines on if you have time. As far as pads go, honestly - smoke the stock f**kers on the track and have new ones for when you get home. Any decent pad is going to cost you too much money for your intended usage. The number one mistake noobs make is overbraking. I was NOTORIOUS for it. IMO too good of pads too early is no better than running race tires too early. They will mask your mistakes. There is no sense learning on $250 worth of pads, and IMO the Hawk HP+ are WAY too damned noisy for the street.

On more than one occasion i've had race car issues and ended up slapping the race tires back on my 06' at the last minute and running on stock pads. It can be done. You will melt them off in a weekend, but better to spend $89 on a set of HPS when you get home than to smoke a good set learning. Trust me - I spent WAY too much money WAY too early and learned the hard way. Wisdom is expensive lol.

houstonnw

I did about 10 track days with stock brake pads, brake fluid, and the 17" Pirelli all-seasons.

I did this because people that I trusted said to improve the driver and not the car. The stock tires have much lower limits, to give you a chance to learn to drive. The stock brake pads will eventually introduce you to brake fade. Better to learn at 60 than 120!

I finally upgraded the tires when I was moved up into a faster group and was a rolling roadblock. That required a brake pad upgrade as I now had serious brake fade.

Here are my suggestions for a first track day, repeating some of ones mentioned above:

1. Take a tire pressure gauge, torque wrench (100 ft-lbs for S197 lug nuts, check them before every session), a quart of oil, paper towels, and glass cleaner. Painters tape works great for numbers. Optional would be a floor jack and a toolbox just in case.

2. Take a cooler full of water and some kind of sports drink - stay hydrated! If they don't have food at the track, take lunch and some granola bars.

3. Take a pad and write down notes after every session. You will be so overwhelmed learning the line and watching for faster cars that it will be very hard to take everything in.

4. Have fun! You're not going to set any track records and they don't give out a trophy at HPDE's anyway. Listen and learn, listen and learn.

Back to the brakes. When I was sent out solo for the first time, I decided to brake early and look for the apex. Suddenly I was driving rather than trying to play "connect the dots" around the racetrack. You don't gain a lot by late braking and it's the last place you look for time based on the books I've read. Maybe that's why I've always been easy on brakes.

UrS4

A couple of things that I have found helpful:

A cooler with lots of water, snacks, folding chair, sun screen, appropriate shoes, small tarp to cover your stuff in case of rain (if you don't have a garage/covered space)

torque wrench, extra brake fluid, jack (in case you need to rotate tires), good tire guage, small tool set, work gloves

hopefully you can switch out your pards, lines, and fluid. if you can't hopefully you don't have many miles on the stockers, as your pads wont' have a chance if you have 3-4 sessions. Newcomers overbrake, the rears wear out faster. Check your tires and pads after every session, HPDE are very fun and addicting but don't risk another session if your pads are toast, over running a turn can be unnerving, just remember, if you are going off track, drive straight off and don't jerk the wheel trying to turn

pull the center caps off your wheels if possible, a session will heat the wheels and the plastic center caps might work their way loose, you don't want to send one off into the weeds or on the track where the guy behind you can run over them

helmets are required, so buy one or rent one from the club running the event

make sure you have enough gas for each session, 20-30 min session equals about 1/4 tank

lastly, after the session, I would release the hood, drive around for a couple minutes before you park to cool the brakes and engine, then raise the hood to help cool it off, no E brake ever.

Jazzer The Cat

Lots of wonderful info here

I am about to go thisdirection and appreciate all the input. Already have upgraded fluid, SS linesand good pads, now I just need to 'find' a good driver I willhave to hit-up Sam for some pads when they start to go.

Thanks to all!

Jazzer

blk08

Thanks for all of the great info and suggestions, I can't wait to get out there!

I was planning on leaving the brakes alone as I really don't have time this week to work on the car but I just saw the schedule for the day and it looks like I will have seven 30 min sessions. For those of you familiar with Pocono the schedule say's HPDE 1 will have 2 sessions on the north course, 4 on the east (1 solo) and 1 on the south. Now I think I might have to get pads and fluid? My car has less the 5k and that's 90% highway but from what most are saying it sound like I might use up the stock pads with this much time on the track. Also I'm assuming they have regular gas available there? One more question does anyone no how many garage spaces they have and what the chances are of getting one?

This may be a dumb question but I've neverhad to change brake fluid before, is it as simple as bleeding the old fluid out while filling the reservoir with the new fluid?

Argonaut,

I'm in north Jersey, Denville. If all goes well this Friday I plan on trying to get a few more track days in either at Pocono or NJMSP. How did you register for this weekend? I tried using the PDA site but it didn't work so I ended up joining NASA and registering there.

Thanks again for all of the great info,