Long Headers vs Short Headers
3rd Gear Member
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 763
From: Pa
RE: Long Headers vs Short Headers
OK..since everyone who has posted so far has been Pro-longtube.. I'm gonna speak up on the Pro Shortie side of the story...
First off, whoever says that shorties get you 1-3 hp needs to wake the hell up. My shorties did alot more for my top end than my UDP's did, and they are conseravtively quoted at 7. Next, where shorties really shine and where most longtubes lack except in highly modified motors, is in torque production. I won't have dyno numbers until the end of May, but I would easily say my shorties netted me almost as much torque as my CAI/tune combo did. The way longtubes are set up, on a pretty stock motor, with stock type cams, Torque production will be hurt due to less effective scavenging. Long tubes are great for flowing large quantities of exhaust, but when how well it flows matters more than how much, they just fall short.
I garentee you that everyone who posted bad stuff about shortiesd in this thread has no hands on experience with them and is spouting out crap that they heard from a guy who has a friend who knows a guy that once talked to someone who had shorties back in the early 80's... My daily driver has shorties, and a good friend of mine has long tubes and all other mods are the same. The biggest difference between us on the track? My 60' times are about .1 to .15 better than his, he generally traps about 1 to 1.5 mph higher than me. Until the 1/8th I am usually in the lead, at the 1000' we are neck and neck and by the traps, he pulls about 1/8th car
First off, whoever says that shorties get you 1-3 hp needs to wake the hell up. My shorties did alot more for my top end than my UDP's did, and they are conseravtively quoted at 7. Next, where shorties really shine and where most longtubes lack except in highly modified motors, is in torque production. I won't have dyno numbers until the end of May, but I would easily say my shorties netted me almost as much torque as my CAI/tune combo did. The way longtubes are set up, on a pretty stock motor, with stock type cams, Torque production will be hurt due to less effective scavenging. Long tubes are great for flowing large quantities of exhaust, but when how well it flows matters more than how much, they just fall short.
I garentee you that everyone who posted bad stuff about shortiesd in this thread has no hands on experience with them and is spouting out crap that they heard from a guy who has a friend who knows a guy that once talked to someone who had shorties back in the early 80's... My daily driver has shorties, and a good friend of mine has long tubes and all other mods are the same. The biggest difference between us on the track? My 60' times are about .1 to .15 better than his, he generally traps about 1 to 1.5 mph higher than me. Until the 1/8th I am usually in the lead, at the 1000' we are neck and neck and by the traps, he pulls about 1/8th car
2nd Gear Member
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 191
From: Long Island
RE: Long Headers vs Short Headers
ORIGINAL: GT Bob
OK..since everyone who has posted so far has been Pro-longtube.. I'm gonna speak up on the Pro Shortie side of the story...
First off, whoever says that shorties get you 1-3 hp needs to wake the hell up. My shorties did alot more for my top end than my UDP's did, and they are conseravtively quoted at 7. Next, where shorties really shine and where most longtubes lack except in highly modified motors, is in torque production. I won't have dyno numbers until the end of May, but I would easily say my shorties netted me almost as much torque as my CAI/tune combo did. The way longtubes are set up, on a pretty stock motor, with stock type cams, Torque production will be hurt due to less effective scavenging. Long tubes are great for flowing large quantities of exhaust, but when how well it flows matters more than how much, they just fall short.
I garentee you that everyone who posted bad stuff about shortiesd in this thread has no hands on experience with them and is spouting out crap that they heard from a guy who has a friend who knows a guy that once talked to someone who had shorties back in the early 80's... My daily driver has shorties, and a good friend of mine has long tubes and all other mods are the same. The biggest difference between us on the track? My 60' times are about .1 to .15 better than his, he generally traps about 1 to 1.5 mph higher than me. Until the 1/8th I am usually in the lead, at the 1000' we are neck and neck and by the traps, he pulls about 1/8th car
OK..since everyone who has posted so far has been Pro-longtube.. I'm gonna speak up on the Pro Shortie side of the story...
First off, whoever says that shorties get you 1-3 hp needs to wake the hell up. My shorties did alot more for my top end than my UDP's did, and they are conseravtively quoted at 7. Next, where shorties really shine and where most longtubes lack except in highly modified motors, is in torque production. I won't have dyno numbers until the end of May, but I would easily say my shorties netted me almost as much torque as my CAI/tune combo did. The way longtubes are set up, on a pretty stock motor, with stock type cams, Torque production will be hurt due to less effective scavenging. Long tubes are great for flowing large quantities of exhaust, but when how well it flows matters more than how much, they just fall short.
I garentee you that everyone who posted bad stuff about shortiesd in this thread has no hands on experience with them and is spouting out crap that they heard from a guy who has a friend who knows a guy that once talked to someone who had shorties back in the early 80's... My daily driver has shorties, and a good friend of mine has long tubes and all other mods are the same. The biggest difference between us on the track? My 60' times are about .1 to .15 better than his, he generally traps about 1 to 1.5 mph higher than me. Until the 1/8th I am usually in the lead, at the 1000' we are neck and neck and by the traps, he pulls about 1/8th car
nothing but positive things to say about my BBK shorties!
3rd Gear Member
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 531
From: PA
RE: Long Headers vs Short Headers
I'd get LT's but I can't justify 1300 beans not to mention at least 600 to install them, just because people say they are the best. I would have to say bang for the buck and versatility for me is Shorties with a bolt in off road x that you can swap back in your catted H for emissions inspections (in PA anyway) is the best way to go.
2nd Gear Member
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 481
From: Michigan
RE: Long Headers vs Short Headers
From what I was quoted from shops like Alternative Auto & MRT, shorties can be equally as difficult to install as long tubes. And they simply recommend, "assuming your doing this in your own garage" if your going to jack up the engine, remove the starter, remove the steering shaft, might as well do the LT. No difference in procedure. I installed mine in about 9hrs.
From what I've heard in person, the LT will net better results in HP and TQ. + will sound a little deeper. LT have that hollow sound to them. You can usually tell a car has LT just by the sound. Shorties from what I've heard in person, will still deepen up the sound, but not as much. I know most people have stated in the past "OEM flows pretty good", that's true. But anything is better than stock, at least in the exhaust department. As stated above, the benefit of shorties is you have more choices in matching midpipes. LT, must use the matching one, or spend the money to have your existing one "like your stock H" cut to match, which usually rules out ever going back to stock. Unless your in California, then forget LT. Not worth the risk usually.
One thing nobody mentioned is the difference in the primaries. 1 5/8 is best for NA cars. 1 3/4 for FI. I Bought my MAC LT + prochamber for less than $700 new so it doesn't have to cost you an arm and leg to have a LT setup.
Cartel, if you decide on LT I know a guy in MI that has brand new JBA LT ceramics + O/R H for $650. That's a pretty good deal.
From what I've heard in person, the LT will net better results in HP and TQ. + will sound a little deeper. LT have that hollow sound to them. You can usually tell a car has LT just by the sound. Shorties from what I've heard in person, will still deepen up the sound, but not as much. I know most people have stated in the past "OEM flows pretty good", that's true. But anything is better than stock, at least in the exhaust department. As stated above, the benefit of shorties is you have more choices in matching midpipes. LT, must use the matching one, or spend the money to have your existing one "like your stock H" cut to match, which usually rules out ever going back to stock. Unless your in California, then forget LT. Not worth the risk usually.
One thing nobody mentioned is the difference in the primaries. 1 5/8 is best for NA cars. 1 3/4 for FI. I Bought my MAC LT + prochamber for less than $700 new so it doesn't have to cost you an arm and leg to have a LT setup.
Cartel, if you decide on LT I know a guy in MI that has brand new JBA LT ceramics + O/R H for $650. That's a pretty good deal.
2nd Gear Member
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 406
From:
RE: Long Headers vs Short Headers
with just long tubes along i gained 5 tenths ad 4 mph using stock mufflers still. ive used shorties b4 but ive used long tubes on my last 2 cars and both cars gained 5 tenths in the 1/4 mile......i will never use shorties again. and really bang for buck my OBX long tubes r a very good quality and check out my trap speed in my sig. should explain everything
6th Gear Member
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 6,169
From: Chicago, IL
RE: Long Headers vs Short Headers
ORIGINAL: cartel
I have4 questions on Headers..............
[ol][*]Whats the difference between long and short headers?[*]Which gives more horsepower?[*]Are they hard to install?[*]Do they change the sound of the car?[/ol]
I have4 questions on Headers..............
[ol][*]Whats the difference between long and short headers?[*]Which gives more horsepower?[*]Are they hard to install?[*]Do they change the sound of the car?[/ol]
5th Gear Member
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 2,135
From:
RE: Long Headers vs Short Headers
ORIGINAL: cartel
[sm=wakeup.gif]
Trust me, I love this Forum with all my heart, howamart.......But I must admit that the search feature suckssss..It just doesnt work.....I would prefer freshly writeninformation anyway.....Ill have to study andbecome arocket scientist just to figure out that search feature....
[sm=wakeup.gif]
ORIGINAL: howarmat
have you tried the search feature yet?
have you tried the search feature yet?