Whipple is on, but there's a problem :/
11-07-2010, 10:17 AM
#11
2nd Gear Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2006
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Posts: 445
Okay, here are the codes that I get when the CEL goes right on:
P0171 - system too lean in Cylinder 1
P0304 - Cyliner 4 Misfire
P0316 - Misfire detected at start-up
The guy at the shop said that the lean reading is due to the misfire.
Started it again after clearing the codes, No CEL. I decided to run it real quick after warming it up. The A/F dropped to 11.2 when at WOT.
On hunch I ran a system check when I got back even though no CEL - the P0304 and 0316 are still there. I guess the lean code is what sets off the CEL.
I have to say that from what I can tell, the car is running fine. I don't feel/hear any issues. It doesn't run rough or make weird noises. Even the first time the CEL came on and I had to drive it back, it was running fine (I was scared and babying it, but still). The only thing I've noticed is that it feels like it's idling low at the stoplight, but I don't know if that's just due to the whipple. Feels like it's pulsing or loping even though the rpms are steady.
When all of this happened my first thought was that it was the plug.
P0171 - system too lean in Cylinder 1
P0304 - Cyliner 4 Misfire
P0316 - Misfire detected at start-up
The guy at the shop said that the lean reading is due to the misfire.
Started it again after clearing the codes, No CEL. I decided to run it real quick after warming it up. The A/F dropped to 11.2 when at WOT.
On hunch I ran a system check when I got back even though no CEL - the P0304 and 0316 are still there. I guess the lean code is what sets off the CEL.
I have to say that from what I can tell, the car is running fine. I don't feel/hear any issues. It doesn't run rough or make weird noises. Even the first time the CEL came on and I had to drive it back, it was running fine (I was scared and babying it, but still). The only thing I've noticed is that it feels like it's idling low at the stoplight, but I don't know if that's just due to the whipple. Feels like it's pulsing or loping even though the rpms are steady.
When all of this happened my first thought was that it was the plug.
11-07-2010, 10:44 AM
#12
5th Gear Member
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Redding, CA
Posts: 4,552
Okay, here are the codes that I get when the CEL goes right on:
P0171 - system too lean in Cylinder 1
P0304 - Cyliner 4 Misfire
P0316 - Misfire detected at start-up
The guy at the shop said that the lean reading is due to the misfire.
Started it again after clearing the codes, No CEL. I decided to run it real quick after warming it up. The A/F dropped to 11.2 when at WOT.
On hunch I ran a system check when I got back even though no CEL - the P0304 and 0316 are still there. I guess the lean code is what sets off the CEL.
I have to say that from what I can tell, the car is running fine. I don't feel/hear any issues. It doesn't run rough or make weird noises. Even the first time the CEL came on and I had to drive it back, it was running fine (I was scared and babying it, but still). The only thing I've noticed is that it feels like it's idling low at the stoplight, but I don't know if that's just due to the whipple. Feels like it's pulsing or loping even though the rpms are steady.
When all of this happened my first thought was that it was the plug.
P0171 - system too lean in Cylinder 1
P0304 - Cyliner 4 Misfire
P0316 - Misfire detected at start-up
The guy at the shop said that the lean reading is due to the misfire.
Started it again after clearing the codes, No CEL. I decided to run it real quick after warming it up. The A/F dropped to 11.2 when at WOT.
On hunch I ran a system check when I got back even though no CEL - the P0304 and 0316 are still there. I guess the lean code is what sets off the CEL.
I have to say that from what I can tell, the car is running fine. I don't feel/hear any issues. It doesn't run rough or make weird noises. Even the first time the CEL came on and I had to drive it back, it was running fine (I was scared and babying it, but still). The only thing I've noticed is that it feels like it's idling low at the stoplight, but I don't know if that's just due to the whipple. Feels like it's pulsing or loping even though the rpms are steady.
When all of this happened my first thought was that it was the plug.
Do you have stock COPs? If you had never gotten the code before and the you are running the same COPs, I doubt it's the COP.
I would guess that it is not tune related, but it could be. When certain CELs come on it can point to underlying problem. When the CEL comes on for the Cam position Sensor, it is usually the alternator. Neither having nothing to with the other but the system ends up cauing the issue through a series of strange events that don't make sense on their face.
My prediction is the shop can either replace the plug and or the COP with something off of the shelf or they wil switch, one at a time, the plug or the COP to another cylinder. If you feel like it you can do this yourself. Very easy.
Another possability I have seen is tunes that are corrupt. Very unlikely but possable. There are different timing tables for start up, idle, cold based, heted motor, overheated motor, high IATs. There are just so many variables I would be hesitant if I owned a shop to even say it wasn't the tune until I diagnosed.
11-07-2010, 11:16 AM
#15
2nd Gear Member
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Join Date: Jan 2006
Location:
Posts: 445
CJ Pony Parts
I sent an email to the manager and he wrote right back to me. It sounds like a plug issue to him, and he's going to talk to the tech who worked on my car tomorrow morning.
I guess I'm glad for the lean issue at this point. Who knows what the misfire could have done over time without being caught? I'm going to make it a point to check for DTC's every once in awhile even if the CEL isn't on...
I sent an email to the manager and he wrote right back to me. It sounds like a plug issue to him, and he's going to talk to the tech who worked on my car tomorrow morning.
I guess I'm glad for the lean issue at this point. Who knows what the misfire could have done over time without being caught? I'm going to make it a point to check for DTC's every once in awhile even if the CEL isn't on...
11-08-2010, 02:04 PM
#16
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Join Date: Jan 2006
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Posts: 445
Still up in the air with where this is going. Manager mentioned sending me a new plug for the 4th cylinder to see if that would take care of the issue. He was going to try contacting Ford about it, but I don't know if he got a hold of them yet.
Would the plug be something readily available at a dealer or at an auto parts store? Would it be hard to replace myself? I've thrown CAI on my other mustangs, but I've never changed plugs myself...special tools needed?
I know this sounds bad, but I might just take it to the dealer and have them do it to avoid any other issues/questions.
Would the plug be something readily available at a dealer or at an auto parts store? Would it be hard to replace myself? I've thrown CAI on my other mustangs, but I've never changed plugs myself...special tools needed?
I know this sounds bad, but I might just take it to the dealer and have them do it to avoid any other issues/questions.
11-09-2010, 07:07 PM
#18
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Join Date: Jan 2006
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Posts: 445
Not yet. I am going to take back to the shop on Thursday. Can be anything from a bad plug to a bad o-ring, injector or vacuum leak. The good news is that they are all small jobs, so I should be able to drive it home and not have to worry about the train or bus.
The worst part is having my car sitting there with the supercharger I've always wanted and not being able to drive it...
The worst part is having my car sitting there with the supercharger I've always wanted and not being able to drive it...
11-09-2010, 08:44 PM
#19
3rd Gear Member
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Kennesaw, GA
Posts: 808
I know what that feels like man. I had to hold off driving my car for a while due to some problems with the install. I had a similar problem with the misfiring. One of my plugs wasn't gapped correctly, so you could check that. But it could be anything from an injector to a vacuum leak. Good luck.
11-12-2010, 11:58 AM
#20
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Join Date: Jan 2006
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Posts: 445
Turns out the issue was caused by a bad/missing O-Ring on one of the injectors. Fire the car up and everything is perfect - the idle is smooth and she pulls like a beast.
An hour into my trip home, tragedy strikes - I see the fuel pressure drop to zero and I coast to the side of the road. After a minute or two I try the key and the pressure is back up. I give CJ Pony a call and am now on my way back to the shop. Halfway there, it happens again and I get it to restart. 15 minutes away and it happens a third time, but this time I can't get it to go and they send a truck to pick me up.
When I get back to the shop, they take everything apart - all of the connections under the hood seem okay, they take out the fuel pump and that seems okay. It turns out that the new issue was that a connection for the fuel pump came loose in the trunk. This just goes to show another reason why you should bring your stock parts home lol - I had my parts in the trunk and when they bumped around the connection came apart. The instructions that came with the kit didn't put the relay in the best of places, so they moved it around and secured it this time. If I didn't have my parts back there now, there's no telling when this might have happened down the road. I'd rather have it straight now than have it happen later.
All in all, I have have to mention how great CJ Pony was about everything. First off they fought with Ford Racing to get another set of plugs overnighted in, and fit me into their busy schedule at my convenience (no pushing me off until it worked better for them). Then they went even further by sending a truck for me and staying late after business hours to see the issue through when the new issue popped up. There was no rushing to find an answer - they even took the extra precautions to make sure we had the problem solved before sending me on my way again.
What says a lot about their service in my eyes is that they could have just sent me home and said they would call me when they looked at it the next day, but they really stood behind their work and did everything to make sure I was taken care of. It was a decent ride to get there, but IMO it was definitely worth it to deal with those guys.
An hour into my trip home, tragedy strikes - I see the fuel pressure drop to zero and I coast to the side of the road. After a minute or two I try the key and the pressure is back up. I give CJ Pony a call and am now on my way back to the shop. Halfway there, it happens again and I get it to restart. 15 minutes away and it happens a third time, but this time I can't get it to go and they send a truck to pick me up.
When I get back to the shop, they take everything apart - all of the connections under the hood seem okay, they take out the fuel pump and that seems okay. It turns out that the new issue was that a connection for the fuel pump came loose in the trunk. This just goes to show another reason why you should bring your stock parts home lol - I had my parts in the trunk and when they bumped around the connection came apart. The instructions that came with the kit didn't put the relay in the best of places, so they moved it around and secured it this time. If I didn't have my parts back there now, there's no telling when this might have happened down the road. I'd rather have it straight now than have it happen later.
All in all, I have have to mention how great CJ Pony was about everything. First off they fought with Ford Racing to get another set of plugs overnighted in, and fit me into their busy schedule at my convenience (no pushing me off until it worked better for them). Then they went even further by sending a truck for me and staying late after business hours to see the issue through when the new issue popped up. There was no rushing to find an answer - they even took the extra precautions to make sure we had the problem solved before sending me on my way again.
What says a lot about their service in my eyes is that they could have just sent me home and said they would call me when they looked at it the next day, but they really stood behind their work and did everything to make sure I was taken care of. It was a decent ride to get there, but IMO it was definitely worth it to deal with those guys.
Last edited by chidrock; 11-12-2010 at 12:10 PM.