NEW GUYS THINKING ABOUT EXHAUST SYSTEMS
08-25-2006, 05:17 PM
#11
6th Gear Member
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Ohio
Posts: 6,448
RE: NEW GUYS THINKING ABOUT EXHAUST SYSTEMS
I will agree that welding in mufflers is a good starter mod. It was my first one only cause I was broke that day cause I drained my savings for the downpayment and drove from the dealership to the muffler shop. But now I have full exhaust (long tube, O/R prochamber and catback) and I would never trade it in for some weld in mufflers. I spent just under $900 for the system and it is worth every penny. I gained around 20rwhp and when I drive by the girls their panties get wet. The guys say it sounds bad ***.
Its cool to give advice out to the young guys that dont have alot of money and tell them to start off with some weld on's, but don't give bad advice cause your not happy with what you spent your money on.
Its cool to give advice out to the young guys that dont have alot of money and tell them to start off with some weld on's, but don't give bad advice cause your not happy with what you spent your money on.
08-25-2006, 05:30 PM
#12
5th Gear Member
Join Date: May 2005
Location: New Jersey
Posts: 4,536
RE: NEW GUYS THINKING ABOUT EXHAUST SYSTEMS
ORIGINAL: sweet99
Sorry but most of that is incorrect. I said it is difficult to get a 2v 4.6 into the 13's not the 12's. 12's would be almost impossible if not impractical needing NOS. I said 13's with bolt ons. Street tires. I am not interested in having a 3000 stall copnverter and slicks to get 13's when most of my activity is on the street so I want engine POWER. Needing some kind of measuring stick I use a passport timer. It may not be the most accurate method but I cannot think of a better way to test mods or tuning changes immediatly. Somebody talking junk said 12's with a 2v. Dan with the supercharged cobra I think who has 130HP more than a 2V and runs a 12.5x! He should be in the 11's. My last car did 11's and 120+MPH. Turbo Talon with a lot of money invested which I don't want to do with my automatic convertible. Not many Mustangs running 11's and capable of 122MPH traps here are there? Don't get me wrong I love this Mustang. My mods are listed and thay gained .4 and 4 mph over stock and cost around $2000. Not a good return is it? Then in the thread about 2v's and getting into the 13's guys say "I know lots of guys who have done 13's". Show me who. Show me what mods they have. Tell me what is missing from my mod list for the POWER to get into the 13's, not by hooking and getting a 1.8 60'. Is it possible without a SC?
I have been to the track, just haven't been since '79 I believe. Again for the timer we compared it to the track time with a 440 GTX and found that the timer was off by .2 on the fast side and I am only using it as a measuring stick, not interested in total accuracy.
If you think another exhaust system besides the PYPES will produce a significant amount of more HP you are incorrect. The ONLY difference is I chose the quietest mufflers PYPES sells which are still a straight thru design! I'm 53 and do not want a loud car. I've been through that stage 30 years ago!
Then nobody came up with guys running a 2v in the 13's on street tires and what mods they used to do it in a car weighing 3350lbs. plus the driver. My testing takes place with a friend watching the timer bringing the weight of my car to 3750lbs.with an automatic that can't be launched with any kind of power launch or it would fry the 315's I have for traction.
I know with slicks and a hard launch I would get into the 13's as I have done 14.02 with the weight and launch and street tires mentioned above. My full PYPES exhaust with catted X-pipe that keeps the car legal probably gave the car 10-15whp tops! Given the opportunity to go back I would have added mufflers and been done with it and maybe given up 5whp. 5WHP for $600. when a pair of mufflers would have been $150. and have cost no more than $50. to have installed. I would take the 5WHP loss and pocket the $400. By the way what is YOUR best track time and trap?
All I'm trying to do is save some 18-20 year old kid who wants an exhaust system but doesn't have $600.-$800. for the 15WHP return and sound. I don't need sound. Mine sounded fine when it had the stock exhaust but as you know I am trying for the power to get 13's. mark
ORIGINAL: bigedog8damnit sweet first u talk about not being able to get a gt in the 12's then u tell us uve never actually been to a strip and ur using some g tech **** to do ur quarter mile..... now u say buy weld in mufflers..... have u ever had a car with a weld in muffler... they suck compared to a catback. sound quality is crappy. volume is low. and there is still all the restriction of the smaller pipe as red2k1 already stated. and an o/r pipe makes your car sound like sex... it also doesnt help you bought one of the cheapest catbacks out there for your car.... please dont be giving people retarded advice. u can buy a good catback for about 370ish i got mine on sale for cheaper... by the time u buy 2 mufflers at around 100 bucks get em welded in why not just pay 200 bucks more for more hp AND much better sound quality
I have been to the track, just haven't been since '79 I believe. Again for the timer we compared it to the track time with a 440 GTX and found that the timer was off by .2 on the fast side and I am only using it as a measuring stick, not interested in total accuracy.
If you think another exhaust system besides the PYPES will produce a significant amount of more HP you are incorrect. The ONLY difference is I chose the quietest mufflers PYPES sells which are still a straight thru design! I'm 53 and do not want a loud car. I've been through that stage 30 years ago!
Then nobody came up with guys running a 2v in the 13's on street tires and what mods they used to do it in a car weighing 3350lbs. plus the driver. My testing takes place with a friend watching the timer bringing the weight of my car to 3750lbs.with an automatic that can't be launched with any kind of power launch or it would fry the 315's I have for traction.
I know with slicks and a hard launch I would get into the 13's as I have done 14.02 with the weight and launch and street tires mentioned above. My full PYPES exhaust with catted X-pipe that keeps the car legal probably gave the car 10-15whp tops! Given the opportunity to go back I would have added mufflers and been done with it and maybe given up 5whp. 5WHP for $600. when a pair of mufflers would have been $150. and have cost no more than $50. to have installed. I would take the 5WHP loss and pocket the $400. By the way what is YOUR best track time and trap?
All I'm trying to do is save some 18-20 year old kid who wants an exhaust system but doesn't have $600.-$800. for the 15WHP return and sound. I don't need sound. Mine sounded fine when it had the stock exhaust but as you know I am trying for the power to get 13's. mark
with the right suspension, tires, gears, UDP's, good clutch/light flywheel, shorty shifty, good driver, UCA, LCA, subframes, exhaust, and a good launch, you can tap into really high 12s.
08-25-2006, 05:42 PM
#13
6th Gear Member
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 12,575
RE: NEW GUYS THINKING ABOUT EXHAUST SYSTEMS
ORIGINAL: red2k1gt
Everyone's entitled to express their personal preference about this, I wouldnt call it a write up. Let's just say this: with a catback and aftermarket midpipe your going to make approximately 5-7 more rwhp more than a person with just weld-ins. On the other hand...the person with the aftermarket catback/midpipe is going to have a MUCH better sounding car. It all depends on what you want to do with your car and how much money you really want to spend.
Everyone's entitled to express their personal preference about this, I wouldnt call it a write up. Let's just say this: with a catback and aftermarket midpipe your going to make approximately 5-7 more rwhp more than a person with just weld-ins. On the other hand...the person with the aftermarket catback/midpipe is going to have a MUCH better sounding car. It all depends on what you want to do with your car and how much money you really want to spend.
However, the "stock H pipe" is total junk. You can easily pick up 10-12 WHP with no tuning by just swapping to a aftermarket h/x, espcially a o/r model.
Not to mention what red said about the sound. You don't get nearly the sound out of a set of weld ins that you do a catback.
And that doesn't even bring up the cool aftermarket tips
BTW: Once you start modding it will really make a difference. I have heard gains of 15-20 WHP from just a midpipe and catback on a blown 2v car.
08-25-2006, 05:44 PM
#14
6th Gear Member
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 12,575
RE: NEW GUYS THINKING ABOUT EXHAUST SYSTEMS
ORIGINAL: sweet99
Sorry but most of that is incorrect. I said it is difficult to get a 2v 4.6 into the 13's not the 12's. 12's would be almost impossible if not impractical needing NOS. I said 13's with bolt ons. Street tires. I am not interested in having a 3000 stall copnverter and slicks to get 13's when most of my activity is on the street so I want engine POWER. Needing some kind of measuring stick I use a passport timer. It may not be the most accurate method but I cannot think of a better way to test mods or tuning changes immediatly. Somebody talking junk said 12's with a 2v. Dan with the supercharged cobra I think who has 130HP more than a 2V and runs a 12.5x! He should be in the 11's. My last car did 11's and 120+MPH. Turbo Talon with a lot of money invested which I don't want to do with my automatic convertible. Not many Mustangs running 11's and capable of 122MPH traps here are there? Don't get me wrong I love this Mustang. My mods are listed and thay gained .4 and 4 mph over stock and cost around $2000. Not a good return is it? Then in the thread about 2v's and getting into the 13's guys say "I know lots of guys who have done 13's". Show me who. Show me what mods they have. Tell me what is missing from my mod list for the POWER to get into the 13's, not by hooking and getting a 1.8 60'. Is it possible without a SC?
I have been to the track, just haven't been since '79 I believe. Again for the timer we compared it to the track time with a 440 GTX and found that the timer was off by .2 on the fast side and I am only using it as a measuring stick, not interested in total accuracy.
If you think another exhaust system besides the PYPES will produce a significant amount of more HP you are incorrect. The ONLY difference is I chose the quietest mufflers PYPES sells which are still a straight thru design! I'm 53 and do not want a loud car. I've been through that stage 30 years ago!
Then nobody came up with guys running a 2v in the 13's on street tires and what mods they used to do it in a car weighing 3350lbs. plus the driver. My testing takes place with a friend watching the timer bringing the weight of my car to 3750lbs.with an automatic that can't be launched with any kind of power launch or it would fry the 315's I have for traction.
I know with slicks and a hard launch I would get into the 13's as I have done 14.02 with the weight and launch and street tires mentioned above. My full PYPES exhaust with catted X-pipe that keeps the car legal probably gave the car 10-15whp tops! Given the opportunity to go back I would have added mufflers and been done with it and maybe given up 5whp. 5WHP for $600. when a pair of mufflers would have been $150. and have cost no more than $50. to have installed. I would take the 5WHP loss and pocket the $400. By the way what is YOUR best track time and trap?
All I'm trying to do is save some 18-20 year old kid who wants an exhaust system but doesn't have $600.-$800. for the 15WHP return and sound. I don't need sound. Mine sounded fine when it had the stock exhaust but as you know I am trying for the power to get 13's. mark
ORIGINAL: bigedog8damnit sweet first u talk about not being able to get a gt in the 12's then u tell us uve never actually been to a strip and ur using some g tech **** to do ur quarter mile..... now u say buy weld in mufflers..... have u ever had a car with a weld in muffler... they suck compared to a catback. sound quality is crappy. volume is low. and there is still all the restriction of the smaller pipe as red2k1 already stated. and an o/r pipe makes your car sound like sex... it also doesnt help you bought one of the cheapest catbacks out there for your car.... please dont be giving people retarded advice. u can buy a good catback for about 370ish i got mine on sale for cheaper... by the time u buy 2 mufflers at around 100 bucks get em welded in why not just pay 200 bucks more for more hp AND much better sound quality
I have been to the track, just haven't been since '79 I believe. Again for the timer we compared it to the track time with a 440 GTX and found that the timer was off by .2 on the fast side and I am only using it as a measuring stick, not interested in total accuracy.
If you think another exhaust system besides the PYPES will produce a significant amount of more HP you are incorrect. The ONLY difference is I chose the quietest mufflers PYPES sells which are still a straight thru design! I'm 53 and do not want a loud car. I've been through that stage 30 years ago!
Then nobody came up with guys running a 2v in the 13's on street tires and what mods they used to do it in a car weighing 3350lbs. plus the driver. My testing takes place with a friend watching the timer bringing the weight of my car to 3750lbs.with an automatic that can't be launched with any kind of power launch or it would fry the 315's I have for traction.
I know with slicks and a hard launch I would get into the 13's as I have done 14.02 with the weight and launch and street tires mentioned above. My full PYPES exhaust with catted X-pipe that keeps the car legal probably gave the car 10-15whp tops! Given the opportunity to go back I would have added mufflers and been done with it and maybe given up 5whp. 5WHP for $600. when a pair of mufflers would have been $150. and have cost no more than $50. to have installed. I would take the 5WHP loss and pocket the $400. By the way what is YOUR best track time and trap?
All I'm trying to do is save some 18-20 year old kid who wants an exhaust system but doesn't have $600.-$800. for the 15WHP return and sound. I don't need sound. Mine sounded fine when it had the stock exhaust but as you know I am trying for the power to get 13's. mark
And you definatlyi don't need slicks and a full suspesion to get a 1.8 60'. JD did just that with his nittos and upper/lower control arms.
EDIT: Remeber with your cobra example that he is also doing this with a IRS and ALOT more wieght.
08-25-2006, 05:46 PM
#15
Retired MF Moderator
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: I live in Canada, eh
Posts: 7,156
RE: NEW GUYS THINKING ABOUT EXHAUST SYSTEMS
ORIGINAL: StickShifty
with the right suspension, tires, gears, UDP's, good clutch/light flywheel, shorty shifty, good driver, UCA, LCA, subframes, exhaust, and a good launch, you can tap into really high 12s.
ORIGINAL: sweet99
Sorry but most of that is incorrect. I said it is difficult to get a 2v 4.6 into the 13's not the 12's. 12's would be almost impossible if not impractical needing NOS. I said 13's with bolt ons. Street tires. I am not interested in having a 3000 stall copnverter and slicks to get 13's when most of my activity is on the street so I want engine POWER. Needing some kind of measuring stick I use a passport timer. It may not be the most accurate method but I cannot think of a better way to test mods or tuning changes immediatly. Somebody talking junk said 12's with a 2v. Dan with the supercharged cobra I think who has 130HP more than a 2V and runs a 12.5x! He should be in the 11's. My last car did 11's and 120+MPH. Turbo Talon with a lot of money invested which I don't want to do with my automatic convertible. Not many Mustangs running 11's and capable of 122MPH traps here are there? Don't get me wrong I love this Mustang. My mods are listed and thay gained .4 and 4 mph over stock and cost around $2000. Not a good return is it? Then in the thread about 2v's and getting into the 13's guys say "I know lots of guys who have done 13's". Show me who. Show me what mods they have. Tell me what is missing from my mod list for the POWER to get into the 13's, not by hooking and getting a 1.8 60'. Is it possible without a SC?
I have been to the track, just haven't been since '79 I believe. Again for the timer we compared it to the track time with a 440 GTX and found that the timer was off by .2 on the fast side and I am only using it as a measuring stick, not interested in total accuracy.
If you think another exhaust system besides the PYPES will produce a significant amount of more HP you are incorrect. The ONLY difference is I chose the quietest mufflers PYPES sells which are still a straight thru design! I'm 53 and do not want a loud car. I've been through that stage 30 years ago!
Then nobody came up with guys running a 2v in the 13's on street tires and what mods they used to do it in a car weighing 3350lbs. plus the driver. My testing takes place with a friend watching the timer bringing the weight of my car to 3750lbs.with an automatic that can't be launched with any kind of power launch or it would fry the 315's I have for traction.
I know with slicks and a hard launch I would get into the 13's as I have done 14.02 with the weight and launch and street tires mentioned above. My full PYPES exhaust with catted X-pipe that keeps the car legal probably gave the car 10-15whp tops! Given the opportunity to go back I would have added mufflers and been done with it and maybe given up 5whp. 5WHP for $600. when a pair of mufflers would have been $150. and have cost no more than $50. to have installed. I would take the 5WHP loss and pocket the $400. By the way what is YOUR best track time and trap?
All I'm trying to do is save some 18-20 year old kid who wants an exhaust system but doesn't have $600.-$800. for the 15WHP return and sound. I don't need sound. Mine sounded fine when it had the stock exhaust but as you know I am trying for the power to get 13's. mark
ORIGINAL: bigedog8damnit sweet first u talk about not being able to get a gt in the 12's then u tell us uve never actually been to a strip and ur using some g tech **** to do ur quarter mile..... now u say buy weld in mufflers..... have u ever had a car with a weld in muffler... they suck compared to a catback. sound quality is crappy. volume is low. and there is still all the restriction of the smaller pipe as red2k1 already stated. and an o/r pipe makes your car sound like sex... it also doesnt help you bought one of the cheapest catbacks out there for your car.... please dont be giving people retarded advice. u can buy a good catback for about 370ish i got mine on sale for cheaper... by the time u buy 2 mufflers at around 100 bucks get em welded in why not just pay 200 bucks more for more hp AND much better sound quality
I have been to the track, just haven't been since '79 I believe. Again for the timer we compared it to the track time with a 440 GTX and found that the timer was off by .2 on the fast side and I am only using it as a measuring stick, not interested in total accuracy.
If you think another exhaust system besides the PYPES will produce a significant amount of more HP you are incorrect. The ONLY difference is I chose the quietest mufflers PYPES sells which are still a straight thru design! I'm 53 and do not want a loud car. I've been through that stage 30 years ago!
Then nobody came up with guys running a 2v in the 13's on street tires and what mods they used to do it in a car weighing 3350lbs. plus the driver. My testing takes place with a friend watching the timer bringing the weight of my car to 3750lbs.with an automatic that can't be launched with any kind of power launch or it would fry the 315's I have for traction.
I know with slicks and a hard launch I would get into the 13's as I have done 14.02 with the weight and launch and street tires mentioned above. My full PYPES exhaust with catted X-pipe that keeps the car legal probably gave the car 10-15whp tops! Given the opportunity to go back I would have added mufflers and been done with it and maybe given up 5whp. 5WHP for $600. when a pair of mufflers would have been $150. and have cost no more than $50. to have installed. I would take the 5WHP loss and pocket the $400. By the way what is YOUR best track time and trap?
All I'm trying to do is save some 18-20 year old kid who wants an exhaust system but doesn't have $600.-$800. for the 15WHP return and sound. I don't need sound. Mine sounded fine when it had the stock exhaust but as you know I am trying for the power to get 13's. mark
with the right suspension, tires, gears, UDP's, good clutch/light flywheel, shorty shifty, good driver, UCA, LCA, subframes, exhaust, and a good launch, you can tap into really high 12s.
See, the secret here is SUSPENSION & TIRES. He doesn't want to run drag radials so he's fuggered. He is right. The only chance for getting a n/a 2 valve into the 12s is through the launch. They just don't make enough power to do it with 2.xx 60'.
08-25-2006, 05:52 PM
#16
4th Gear Member
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Deltona, fl
Posts: 1,239
RE: NEW GUYS THINKING ABOUT EXHAUST SYSTEMS
if you just have a catback you will see very minimal gains if any. the only way to get hp from a catback is if you have L/T headers o/r midpipe. and people have had 4.6 2v in the 12's with full boltons. its not hard to get a 2v into the 13's, hell people have put them in the 13s bone stock. i ran a 14.065 bone stock. after you buy your mufflers, and get them welded in. your just about at the price of a cat-back and the average joe can install it on their own. my theory is do it right the first time. weld in mufflers will not cut it.
wally
wally
08-25-2006, 05:57 PM
#17
2010 Blue Ball Award Recipient
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Eskimo Village, Indiana *No Igloo*
Posts: 7,907
RE: NEW GUYS THINKING ABOUT EXHAUST SYSTEMS
See, the secret here is SUSPENSION & TIRES. He doesn't want to run drag radials so he's fuggered. He is right. The only chance for getting a n/a 2 valve into the 12s is through the launch. They just don't make enough power to do it with 2.xx 60'.
i mean, take any car really, put forth an average launch (which we seem to be using 2.00 for our cars) and add all the power you want. so youre going to get an ET, then think of a time that is just a bit better than that time, and say you can't get there without wheels.
okay, since that made no sense, listen
You drive a car. This car is only capable of a 10 second quarter mile with full bolt ons N/A.
And you pulled a 2.0 60'. However, you REALLY want a 9.5 second car, but not by improving the launch. Well, then youre **** out of luck. If you dont want to take advantage of where the most can be gained, then why are you complaining.
i know this post made no sense, i just think that certain people are complaining about something they have all the power to change, they just dont want to do anythign about it
08-25-2006, 06:01 PM
#18
4th Gear Member
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Deltona, fl
Posts: 1,239
RE: NEW GUYS THINKING ABOUT EXHAUST SYSTEMS
the launch is everything in racing. that will give you the best results. take the subaru impreza sti. if it didnt have awd and have such good launching you wouldnt have anything. they are beasts from a dig, but from a roll its a different story
08-25-2006, 06:39 PM
#19
I ♥ Acer
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Colorado- 8500 feet!
Posts: 5,928
RE: NEW GUYS THINKING ABOUT EXHAUST SYSTEMS
ORIGINAL: oxfordgt
I will agree that welding in mufflers is a good starter mod. It was my first one only cause I was broke that day cause I drained my savings for the downpayment and drove from the dealership to the muffler shop.
I will agree that welding in mufflers is a good starter mod. It was my first one only cause I was broke that day cause I drained my savings for the downpayment and drove from the dealership to the muffler shop.
08-25-2006, 06:42 PM
#20
3rd Gear Member
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location:
Posts: 969
RE: NEW GUYS THINKING ABOUT EXHAUST SYSTEMS
I already told u with the mods in my sig i am in the 13's.... no suspension, gears, hardly anything on the intake side of the motor. on a 2.15 60' .a few more light mods and drag radials and im gonna make it mid 13's. 13's are easy to reach unless u live in high elevation or drive like my grandma.