What kind of psi can a stock 4.6l hold?
12-26-2006, 10:06 PM
#12
3rd Gear Member
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Anaheim, CA
Posts: 616
RE: What kind of psi can a stock 4.6l hold?
ORIGINAL: ceekay84
I'd say 10psi. Anything above 400rwhp, you're asking for trouble
I'd say 10psi. Anything above 400rwhp, you're asking for trouble
KB @10# boost anda nice safe tune makes for a fun DD car on an otherwise stock motor. That's how I started, butI immediately got hungry for more power.I learned the hard (expensive) way that "DD reliable" and "Big power" are difficult to make work together.
IMO, many of the posters have a much different idea of what "DD reliable" means. To me it means that once the motor has warmed up, you can "drive it like it's stolen", and still last 100k miles.
12-26-2006, 10:42 PM
#13
1st Gear Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2006
Location:
Posts: 70
RE: What kind of psi can a stock 4.6l hold?
Thanks for all the posts everyone. Answered a lot of my questions. I just had a talk with my dad ( it's his title... his rules). I am going have it as a DD for a year. Then he will spot me the money to buy a cheap honda or some poswith good gas milage. The only reason he will do this is because my sister got a brand new 4 runner. I said all that because i need to get a a SC that i can set at 6-10 but when it's not a DD any more I can bore/ rebuild it and make it more of a track car.
12-26-2006, 11:40 PM
#14
2nd Gear Member
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location:
Posts: 194
RE: What kind of psi can a stock 4.6l hold?
Here's what we've found so far, 99-early 01's (windsor motors) will live at 12-14 psi IF THE TUNE is right on and it's cared for...ie: NO hot lapping, no cold start bonzai runs, and no skipping the oil changes. The rear wheel hp is a factor with the stock rods, but it's detonation that kills them. We have supported up to 500 rwhp on stock cars as long as the tune was dead on, the car had no detonation and the motor was in decent shape starting out.
The later 01-04 Romeo motors had a different Ford contractor supplying rods and hence seem to be more prone to fatigue, bending, and such under higher boost loads regardless of tune. One exception to the rule is a local stock 04 GT we are R&D'ing with. It's got an intercooled V-2 on it at 14 psi and laid down 478 rwhp on our Mustang Dyno. We have the tune a bit safer just to see what the upper limit is, but this one is living fine. It hits the track every weekend and it rips. We have it limited with the tune to 6k so you don't starve for fuel at the limiter.
The factory limiter is terrible for power as it cuts fuel. Almost all the aftermarket tuners will extend or simply change the limiter to a random spark drop to keep RPM's in tack.
If you want reliable power, the prochargers are hard to beat and you can start with a D-1sc at moderate boost (8-10 psi), but make sure you have it dyno tuned and that it is pretty safe (11.8 A/F). Also make sure to use premium fuel and race gas if you're gonna dog doesn't hurt. The D-1sc will be the perfect blower to re-pulley for some sick boost later with a built lower end and 700 will be the norm with heads/cams and exhaust.
Good luck!
The later 01-04 Romeo motors had a different Ford contractor supplying rods and hence seem to be more prone to fatigue, bending, and such under higher boost loads regardless of tune. One exception to the rule is a local stock 04 GT we are R&D'ing with. It's got an intercooled V-2 on it at 14 psi and laid down 478 rwhp on our Mustang Dyno. We have the tune a bit safer just to see what the upper limit is, but this one is living fine. It hits the track every weekend and it rips. We have it limited with the tune to 6k so you don't starve for fuel at the limiter.
The factory limiter is terrible for power as it cuts fuel. Almost all the aftermarket tuners will extend or simply change the limiter to a random spark drop to keep RPM's in tack.
If you want reliable power, the prochargers are hard to beat and you can start with a D-1sc at moderate boost (8-10 psi), but make sure you have it dyno tuned and that it is pretty safe (11.8 A/F). Also make sure to use premium fuel and race gas if you're gonna dog doesn't hurt. The D-1sc will be the perfect blower to re-pulley for some sick boost later with a built lower end and 700 will be the norm with heads/cams and exhaust.
Good luck!
12-27-2006, 12:00 AM
#15
2nd Gear Member
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location:
Posts: 236
RE: What kind of psi can a stock 4.6l hold?
This is true you can rebuild the lower end with all forged parts for around $2500, so ive heard, and it will handle upwards of 700hp, which is proven thru the cobra motors which are all forged and the stock block can handle 700rwhp
12-27-2006, 12:10 AM
#17
2nd Gear Member
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location:
Posts: 236
RE: What kind of psi can a stock 4.6l hold?
True true, I see you did it right by swapping out for the cobra motor and then getting probably the best s/c out there, im curious as to what you run in the quarter?.....did you do the motor swap yourself?......sorry if im stealing the thread[&:]
12-27-2006, 01:55 PM
#18
3rd Gear Member
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Anaheim, CA
Posts: 616
RE: What kind of psi can a stock 4.6l hold?
ORIGINAL: Clutch_2000GT
True true, I see you did it right by swapping out for the cobra motor and then getting probably the best s/c out there, im curious as to what you run in the quarter?.....did you do the motor swap yourself?......sorry if im stealing the thread[&:]
True true, I see you did it right by swapping out for the cobra motor and then getting probably the best s/c out there, im curious as to what you run in the quarter?.....did you do the motor swap yourself?......sorry if im stealing the thread[&:]
4v Conversion is still in progress, so I don't have track times yet. Suspension is optimized for Autocross, but the car should be capable of 10's with sticky tires and a good launch. Problem is, since it's a vert, NHRA requires a full cage below 11.99. I have a roll bar, but I'm not putting a cage in my DD.
Motor swap done at a local shop. Only their Master Mechanic touches my car (when he's not busy), which is why this project is taking so damn long =( People should know that a GT-to-Terminator conversion costs $20k + labor to do it right. It's cheaper to sell the GT, buy a Cobra, add a few bolt-ons.
12-27-2006, 02:09 PM
#19
2nd Gear Member
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location:
Posts: 331
RE: What kind of psi can a stock 4.6l hold?
ORIGINAL: jacrockett
4v motor swap decision came after 2 years of chasing hp numbers that the 2v just can't hold with "DD reliability".I made the mistake of taking the KB articles seriously. KB isn't using DD fuel, or a DD tune when they make 500+ rwhp with a GT. My advice to people with 2v motors: On a New Edge mustang; unless you are doing the work yourself (and have a spare car), don't look for more power than the stock internals can make with pump gas and a "safe" tune. As soon as you go past that level, costs skyrocket, and you'llNEVER reach the same power level that a 4v could. The 4v heads are good for an extra 100rwhp, given the same boost #s.
4v Conversion is still in progress, so I don't have track times yet. Suspension is optimized for Autocross, but the car should be capable of 10's with sticky tires and a good launch. Problem is, since it's a vert, NHRA requires a full cage below 11.99. I have a roll bar, but I'm not putting a cage in my DD.
Motor swap done at a local shop. Only their Master Mechanic touches my car (when he's not busy), which is why this project is taking so damn long =( People should know that a GT-to-Terminator conversion costs $20k + labor to do it right. It's cheaper to sell the GT, buy a Cobra, add a few bolt-ons.
ORIGINAL: Clutch_2000GT
True true, I see you did it right by swapping out for the cobra motor and then getting probably the best s/c out there, im curious as to what you run in the quarter?.....did you do the motor swap yourself?......sorry if im stealing the thread[&:]
True true, I see you did it right by swapping out for the cobra motor and then getting probably the best s/c out there, im curious as to what you run in the quarter?.....did you do the motor swap yourself?......sorry if im stealing the thread[&:]
4v Conversion is still in progress, so I don't have track times yet. Suspension is optimized for Autocross, but the car should be capable of 10's with sticky tires and a good launch. Problem is, since it's a vert, NHRA requires a full cage below 11.99. I have a roll bar, but I'm not putting a cage in my DD.
Motor swap done at a local shop. Only their Master Mechanic touches my car (when he's not busy), which is why this project is taking so damn long =( People should know that a GT-to-Terminator conversion costs $20k + labor to do it right. It's cheaper to sell the GT, buy a Cobra, add a few bolt-ons.
Experience is the best teacher.
12-27-2006, 05:23 PM
#20
6th Gear Member
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 12,575
RE: What kind of psi can a stock 4.6l hold?
ORIGINAL: Texas_Hot_Rods
Here's what we've found so far, 99-early 01's (windsor motors) will live at 12-14 psi IF THE TUNE is right on and it's cared for...ie: NO hot lapping, no cold start bonzai runs, and no skipping the oil changes. The rear wheel hp is a factor with the stock rods, but it's detonation that kills them. We have supported up to 500 rwhp on stock cars as long as the tune was dead on, the car had no detonation and the motor was in decent shape starting out.
The later 01-04 Romeo motors had a different Ford contractor supplying rods and hence seem to be more prone to fatigue, bending, and such under higher boost loads regardless of tune. One exception to the rule is a local stock 04 GT we are R&D'ing with. It's got an intercooled V-2 on it at 14 psi and laid down 478 rwhp on our Mustang Dyno. We have the tune a bit safer just to see what the upper limit is, but this one is living fine. It hits the track every weekend and it rips. We have it limited with the tune to 6k so you don't starve for fuel at the limiter.
The factory limiter is terrible for power as it cuts fuel. Almost all the aftermarket tuners will extend or simply change the limiter to a random spark drop to keep RPM's in tack.
If you want reliable power, the prochargers are hard to beat and you can start with a D-1sc at moderate boost (8-10 psi), but make sure you have it dyno tuned and that it is pretty safe (11.8 A/F). Also make sure to use premium fuel and race gas if you're gonna dog doesn't hurt. The D-1sc will be the perfect blower to re-pulley for some sick boost later with a built lower end and 700 will be the norm with heads/cams and exhaust.
Good luck!
Here's what we've found so far, 99-early 01's (windsor motors) will live at 12-14 psi IF THE TUNE is right on and it's cared for...ie: NO hot lapping, no cold start bonzai runs, and no skipping the oil changes. The rear wheel hp is a factor with the stock rods, but it's detonation that kills them. We have supported up to 500 rwhp on stock cars as long as the tune was dead on, the car had no detonation and the motor was in decent shape starting out.
The later 01-04 Romeo motors had a different Ford contractor supplying rods and hence seem to be more prone to fatigue, bending, and such under higher boost loads regardless of tune. One exception to the rule is a local stock 04 GT we are R&D'ing with. It's got an intercooled V-2 on it at 14 psi and laid down 478 rwhp on our Mustang Dyno. We have the tune a bit safer just to see what the upper limit is, but this one is living fine. It hits the track every weekend and it rips. We have it limited with the tune to 6k so you don't starve for fuel at the limiter.
The factory limiter is terrible for power as it cuts fuel. Almost all the aftermarket tuners will extend or simply change the limiter to a random spark drop to keep RPM's in tack.
If you want reliable power, the prochargers are hard to beat and you can start with a D-1sc at moderate boost (8-10 psi), but make sure you have it dyno tuned and that it is pretty safe (11.8 A/F). Also make sure to use premium fuel and race gas if you're gonna dog doesn't hurt. The D-1sc will be the perfect blower to re-pulley for some sick boost later with a built lower end and 700 will be the norm with heads/cams and exhaust.
Good luck!
I am pretty surprised you can even make 500 at all without it going boom. Thats just a ton of WHP on the puny stock rods.