Thought I was fast...
03-03-2006, 06:27 PM
#21
6th Gear Member
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Hamilton, NJ
Posts: 15,042
RE: Thought I was fast...
ORIGINAL: Valcore
Ok, idk whats going on in here with the supra guy and ect.
Anyway, although ur engine is very old, it dosn't mean it is week. Mine runs very strong
You can sc your stock motor! I wouldn't go over 8psi.
Now the real bottleneck on the 5.0 is the heads, like someone said above holley and trickflow make packages (i think around $2000) that will put u in the 350hp range N/A.Then later if u get a s/c....well you know the rest.
I still don't know if I want to get an s/c or h/c/i but at the moment im leaning towrd h/c/i
Unless you have a lot of money, I wouldn't buy a crate engine. You don't need another engine to go fast...
The 350z should beat a 50GT stock for stock but not by a whole lot. The 350z is not "That" fast and you wont have to do much to beat one.
Btw supras are dyno queens. (they are like Peyton Manning, they can put up big numbers but they cant win anything.
)
ORIGINAL: Twisted
Thanks for taking the time to share your experience with me, folks. Good info. I guess I will just slow down, and try to be intelligent about building up my car. Your posts have given me the idea to not S/C my stock motor, but rather to save up another grand or two, and put in a crate motor that is A) fresh, and B) not stock. Then with that foundation--and once I recuperate from the expense--I can think about a S/C. I'm thinking a nice mild crate motor--like 300 horse might suite me just fine. I don't need to be the fastest--just fast. Thanks for realing me back in[sm=smiley20.gif]
Thanks for taking the time to share your experience with me, folks. Good info. I guess I will just slow down, and try to be intelligent about building up my car. Your posts have given me the idea to not S/C my stock motor, but rather to save up another grand or two, and put in a crate motor that is A) fresh, and B) not stock. Then with that foundation--and once I recuperate from the expense--I can think about a S/C. I'm thinking a nice mild crate motor--like 300 horse might suite me just fine. I don't need to be the fastest--just fast
. Thanks for realing me back in[sm=smiley20.gif]
Anyway, although ur engine is very old, it dosn't mean it is week. Mine runs very strong
You can sc your stock motor! I wouldn't go over 8psi.
Now the real bottleneck on the 5.0 is the heads, like someone said above holley and trickflow make packages (i think around $2000) that will put u in the 350hp range N/A.Then later if u get a s/c....well you know the rest.
I still don't know if I want to get an s/c or h/c/i but at the moment im leaning towrd h/c/i
Unless you have a lot of money, I wouldn't buy a crate engine. You don't need another engine to go fast...
The 350z should beat a 50GT stock for stock but not by a whole lot. The 350z is not "That" fast and you wont have to do much to beat one.
Btw supras are dyno queens. (they are like Peyton Manning, they can put up big numbers but they cant win anything.
)
Also, you said that this car sounded like it had a power adder on it. If it had a supercharger/turbo on it than you will have hard time keeping up with him. Like ^ said, if you think that your motor is strong enough, than supercharge it. But personally I would do a set of H/C/I first and than take it from there. Maybe you will be happy with it and just throw a 100 shot and call it a day.
03-03-2006, 07:21 PM
#22
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location:
Posts: 25
RE: Thought I was fast...
I think it all depend on the money you want to put in it.I think the biggest thing is being able to the power to the road.I have a friend you has 6k in motor work,he has a 93 gt.I have a 95 gt conv. I have put 3k in my car, ours cars are just about equal.I spent the money trying the power to the ground.I just think superchargeing a stock motor is a foolish thing to do.The stock heads arent designed for it.The fuel system is not designed for either.If I were on a budget I would rebuild..306 stroker...a good set of heads..
intake..ect..Then think about a poweradder.
intake..ect..Then think about a poweradder.
03-04-2006, 12:16 AM
#25
5th Gear Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location:
Posts: 3,768
RE: Thought I was fast...
Thanks for the replies everyone. Good info. Well, I may have a little time to figure it out. My company downsized yesterday, and now I'm out of work. Just like that. Now my speed money may very well become rent money. Sucks--I was ready to get down.
03-04-2006, 12:36 AM
#26
3rd Gear Member
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 501
RE: Thought I was fast...
ORIGINAL: 89chatofive0
Lost Me At "I'm no expert...."
ORIGINAL: 91MustangGt
I'm no expert or anything, but you're taking a car thats 14 years older than the competition when compared to the 350z, which is better technology,better power and just better engeenearing and trying to beat him stock. Then you compare yourself to a 97 supra, which is basically toyota's top of the line vehicle, basically even up to date and you compare it with your ( bad *** at the time) v8 mustang- none of these comparisons are gonna make you feel good about your car and your "fast".
Personally, I think its best to do things safe and propper rather than cut corners and get the result you want right away, in this case being the fast car that you want to build but with little reliability. IF you turbo it or S/C it as it sits stock, you're wasting time and money, because 6-8 PSI will make you embarass yourself even more when you get pimped by some guy in a subaru or a dodge neon. That kind of boost means nothing on a stock motor.
I'd suggest you be smart about it and take it slow and let it all come together in time, don't worry about beating 30,000 dollar cars 'cause when you're done yours will be much wilder and better than them just because of the fact that you've got a mustang, a real Muscle car.
Prep the engine- rebuild the motor, stroke it if you want, make sure all the internals are good grade and can handle a strong build it, stroked, blown or turboed( but don't build the motor and stop there, just make it ready to handle these force induction applications). With this done, or preferably before, make sure you got a good wiring system that won't let you down, make sure all your ignition components(stock or high performance replacements) all work well, make sure you've got a good cooling system, good exhaust, good intake, good drivetrain, good tranny and good shifter, make sure your tune ups are on time and the car is maintained frequently. Older cars need alot of bolt tightening, gasket checks, oil checks, full tune ups( spark plugs, spark plug wires, distributor cap and rotor, oil change, oil filter change and correct air to fuel ratio) to make them run at their best, all of this is extremely significant when you're prepping your motor.
If you can do this( and it will take time and money) a good set of heads, rear gears, correct full exhaust and a good custom built cam for the application will make any blower, turboed or stroked motor give you probably 30% more power out of your stroke, turbo or supercharge rebuild.
All of these things operate like clock work, only when they're in sync and done properly do they give out the full effect, a blower at 8 to 10 psi would tripple if not quadruple the power you'd get out of a stock supercharged engine. With a good tune, you could easily see 500/600 HP with 8 to 10 psi out of the stroke/heads/cam/ intake and exhaust upgrades, BUT remember, that everything else mentioned is key as well.. And as the other guy mentioned before, if you want to put that power to the ground, you got to get your car to hook and I bet you that you're car is gonna be one hard to beat stang if not The stang to beat.
700-800 HP is useless, its nice to hear someone say they got those numbers, specially if its yourself, but unless you've got a full rear end build up on slicks, thats power you're not putting down, a street car isn't ever seeing over 600 HP if its true street, cause that can't be put down with out a fuill rear end build up on slicks.
BUT, with all seriousness after saying all that, I would strongly advice that the first thing you do, unless you've got mechanical problems, is upgrade your brakes- cross drilled and slotted front rotors, new brake pads, front and rear, have stainless steel braided pads put in, have the hand brake adjusted and the rear drum brakes as well- Because with all this HP comes stupidness, cockiness, ego and the idea that you're not gonna fak up and the last thing you want is to take someones life out on the street cause you want to prove you're a badass to the gimp next to you in a riced out honda crx.
BE SAFE. FIRST RULE. NO EXCEPTIONS.
I'm no expert or anything, but you're taking a car thats 14 years older than the competition when compared to the 350z, which is better technology,better power and just better engeenearing and trying to beat him stock. Then you compare yourself to a 97 supra, which is basically toyota's top of the line vehicle, basically even up to date and you compare it with your ( bad *** at the time) v8 mustang- none of these comparisons are gonna make you feel good about your car and your "fast".
Personally, I think its best to do things safe and propper rather than cut corners and get the result you want right away, in this case being the fast car that you want to build but with little reliability. IF you turbo it or S/C it as it sits stock, you're wasting time and money, because 6-8 PSI will make you embarass yourself even more when you get pimped by some guy in a subaru or a dodge neon. That kind of boost means nothing on a stock motor.
I'd suggest you be smart about it and take it slow and let it all come together in time, don't worry about beating 30,000 dollar cars 'cause when you're done yours will be much wilder and better than them just because of the fact that you've got a mustang, a real Muscle car.
Prep the engine- rebuild the motor, stroke it if you want, make sure all the internals are good grade and can handle a strong build it, stroked, blown or turboed( but don't build the motor and stop there, just make it ready to handle these force induction applications). With this done, or preferably before, make sure you got a good wiring system that won't let you down, make sure all your ignition components(stock or high performance replacements) all work well, make sure you've got a good cooling system, good exhaust, good intake, good drivetrain, good tranny and good shifter, make sure your tune ups are on time and the car is maintained frequently. Older cars need alot of bolt tightening, gasket checks, oil checks, full tune ups( spark plugs, spark plug wires, distributor cap and rotor, oil change, oil filter change and correct air to fuel ratio) to make them run at their best, all of this is extremely significant when you're prepping your motor.
If you can do this( and it will take time and money) a good set of heads, rear gears, correct full exhaust and a good custom built cam for the application will make any blower, turboed or stroked motor give you probably 30% more power out of your stroke, turbo or supercharge rebuild.
All of these things operate like clock work, only when they're in sync and done properly do they give out the full effect, a blower at 8 to 10 psi would tripple if not quadruple the power you'd get out of a stock supercharged engine. With a good tune, you could easily see 500/600 HP with 8 to 10 psi out of the stroke/heads/cam/ intake and exhaust upgrades, BUT remember, that everything else mentioned is key as well.. And as the other guy mentioned before, if you want to put that power to the ground, you got to get your car to hook and I bet you that you're car is gonna be one hard to beat stang if not The stang to beat.
700-800 HP is useless, its nice to hear someone say they got those numbers, specially if its yourself, but unless you've got a full rear end build up on slicks, thats power you're not putting down, a street car isn't ever seeing over 600 HP if its true street, cause that can't be put down with out a fuill rear end build up on slicks.
BUT, with all seriousness after saying all that, I would strongly advice that the first thing you do, unless you've got mechanical problems, is upgrade your brakes- cross drilled and slotted front rotors, new brake pads, front and rear, have stainless steel braided pads put in, have the hand brake adjusted and the rear drum brakes as well- Because with all this HP comes stupidness, cockiness, ego and the idea that you're not gonna fak up and the last thing you want is to take someones life out on the street cause you want to prove you're a badass to the gimp next to you in a riced out honda crx.
BE SAFE. FIRST RULE. NO EXCEPTIONS.
Lost Me At "I'm no expert...."
03-04-2006, 02:23 AM
#27
5th Gear Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location:
Posts: 3,768
RE: Thought I was fast...
ORIGINAL: philthy89fifty
if your gonna shell out the cash for a crate motor get a good one (more than 300hp and not a ford racing motor) with some afr heads forged internals ect. you'll be killin em.
if your gonna shell out the cash for a crate motor get a good one (more than 300hp and not a ford racing motor) with some afr heads forged internals ect. you'll be killin em.
03-04-2006, 05:28 AM
#28
1st Gear Member
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 98
RE: Thought I was fast...
Thanks dubs, hehe!
I'm sorry to hear about that Twisted- But I'm sure you'll get another job soon =)
The cash flow is very important, you're never done when you start wrenching at your engine, like I said before it requires alot of maintenance, and I don't mean the cheap pep boys and autozone stuff, not if you want to keep it running mint condition.
The Z is a better car than a 5.0, I don't mean to talk smack, but I've noticed that alot of people have to high expectations out of these motors stock- people tell stories of these cars running 13 second quarter miles, 12's and so on and thats just not true. Its all in the numbers and the mathematics of it. Just because we got 5.0 litre engines doesn't mean that it equals out to insane amounts of powers- Not stock. 5.0's are like the Honda CRX's and civic hatchbacks of the muscle car world- Its one of the best cars to build up because of its insane potential but its nothing to brag about not a days- back in the 90's 225 whp was something to brag about, now a days it means nothing 'cause almost everything coming out is hitting 260 and up stock( vans, suv's, sedans etc etc) and what we've got stock is 225, don't lie to yourself or let others lie to you about it- you're in for a big disappointment. Don't turn into one of those " i put headers on my honda now I got lke 900 HP" guys with these idea's that an intake and gears can put you into the 13's... oh please lol! if it were that easy.
Rebuilding a motor takes alot of time, and alot of money if someone else is doing it. Building a motor that's prepped for force induction takes even more time and money. 2,000 isn't gonna get ya a crate engine Twisted =( that just won't happen man, what you can get for that is a good stroker kit with forged internals or a good set of heads with a nice custom built cam, that'll put ya into the 290's if the heads are prepped( AFR's come like that) or you could go for a small shot of nos, but that'd be the last thing I'd do, if you're not a good driver I don't recommend it 'cause you don't wanna be missing shifts when you're using nos.
I'd say enjoy it as it is now, get really comfortable at driving it and just cruise it while you decide what you want to do with it after you've done some research, you'll think alot clearer. 'Cause either way you go, once you're not stock, expenses won't stop coming.
Ben
03-04-2006, 08:59 AM
#29
3rd Gear Member
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location:
Posts: 762
RE: Thought I was fast...
ORIGINAL: 91MustangGt
Thanks dubs, hehe!
I'm sorry to hear about that Twisted- But I'm sure you'll get another job soon =)
The cash flow is very important, you're never done when you start wrenching at your engine, like I said before it requires alot of maintenance, and I don't mean the cheap pep boys and autozone stuff, not if you want to keep it running mint condition.
The Z is a better car than a 5.0, I don't mean to talk smack, but I've noticed that alot of people have to high expectations out of these motors stock- people tell stories of these cars running 13 second quarter miles, 12's and so on and thats just not true. Its all in the numbers and the mathematics of it. Just because we got 5.0 litre engines doesn't mean that it equals out to insane amounts of powers- Not stock. 5.0's are like the Honda CRX's and civic hatchbacks of the muscle car world- Its one of the best cars to build up because of its insane potential but its nothing to brag about not a days- back in the 90's 225 whp was something to brag about, now a days it means nothing 'cause almost everything coming out is hitting 260 and up stock( vans, suv's, sedans etc etc) and what we've got stock is 225, don't lie to yourself or let others lie to you about it- you're in for a big disappointment. Don't turn into one of those " i put headers on my honda now I got lke 900 HP" guys with these idea's that an intake and gears can put you into the 13's... oh please lol! if it were that easy.
Rebuilding a motor takes alot of time, and alot of money if someone else is doing it. Building a motor that's prepped for force induction takes even more time and money. 2,000 isn't gonna get ya a crate engine Twisted =( that just won't happen man, what you can get for that is a good stroker kit with forged internals or a good set of heads with a nice custom built cam, that'll put ya into the 290's if the heads are prepped( AFR's come like that) or you could go for a small shot of nos, but that'd be the last thing I'd do, if you're not a good driver I don't recommend it 'cause you don't wanna be missing shifts when you're using nos.
I'd say enjoy it as it is now, get really comfortable at driving it and just cruise it while you decide what you want to do with it after you've done some research, you'll think alot clearer. 'Cause either way you go, once you're not stock, expenses won't stop coming.
Ben
Thanks dubs, hehe!
I'm sorry to hear about that Twisted- But I'm sure you'll get another job soon =)
The cash flow is very important, you're never done when you start wrenching at your engine, like I said before it requires alot of maintenance, and I don't mean the cheap pep boys and autozone stuff, not if you want to keep it running mint condition.
The Z is a better car than a 5.0, I don't mean to talk smack, but I've noticed that alot of people have to high expectations out of these motors stock- people tell stories of these cars running 13 second quarter miles, 12's and so on and thats just not true. Its all in the numbers and the mathematics of it. Just because we got 5.0 litre engines doesn't mean that it equals out to insane amounts of powers- Not stock. 5.0's are like the Honda CRX's and civic hatchbacks of the muscle car world- Its one of the best cars to build up because of its insane potential but its nothing to brag about not a days- back in the 90's 225 whp was something to brag about, now a days it means nothing 'cause almost everything coming out is hitting 260 and up stock( vans, suv's, sedans etc etc) and what we've got stock is 225, don't lie to yourself or let others lie to you about it- you're in for a big disappointment. Don't turn into one of those " i put headers on my honda now I got lke 900 HP" guys with these idea's that an intake and gears can put you into the 13's... oh please lol! if it were that easy.
Rebuilding a motor takes alot of time, and alot of money if someone else is doing it. Building a motor that's prepped for force induction takes even more time and money. 2,000 isn't gonna get ya a crate engine Twisted =( that just won't happen man, what you can get for that is a good stroker kit with forged internals or a good set of heads with a nice custom built cam, that'll put ya into the 290's if the heads are prepped( AFR's come like that) or you could go for a small shot of nos, but that'd be the last thing I'd do, if you're not a good driver I don't recommend it 'cause you don't wanna be missing shifts when you're using nos.
I'd say enjoy it as it is now, get really comfortable at driving it and just cruise it while you decide what you want to do with it after you've done some research, you'll think alot clearer. 'Cause either way you go, once you're not stock, expenses won't stop coming.
Ben
Not many people spend $2000-$4000 on a 5.0stang only to keep it stock
