MD82

What happens if my harmonic balancer's so rusty that I think the pointers have rusted away?

stanglx2002

take a wire bruch it and brush the rust off until you can see the number again. Then i would paint it so it doesnt rust again unless you want to buy a new one

GT350Stang

so should i keep on going or should i just keep it where it is. i heard that if i go any higher that it is pointless because it decreases the power. is this true?

P.S.I.cho

too high will decrease the power yes, u will also here a pinging noise if its too high

83GT306

Not trying to answer for NOS/408, but you brought up an interesting point that someone should comment on.
I think NOS/408's set-up is carbed with the distributor locked in at 32 degrees, which doesn't mean it gets "all" of those 32 degrees at once. It just won't advance any farther than that.
It will advance the weights gradually until it reaches the 32 degrees at a certain rpm, usually all degrees are in before 3000 rpms.
Say you set your initial timing at idle on the balancer to 14 degrees, there will be 18 degrees left for the distributor to advance, total, no more, that's without vacuum advance on the distributor.
Say you set your initial timing at idle on the balancer to 14 degrees, depending on whether or not you have vacuum advance also, and what kind of vacuum it's hooked up to, ported, or full vacuum, ported vacuum will advance the timing gradually as engine speed increases, full vacuum will pull all the degrees from the vacuum canister at idle, plus the initial amount set at the balancer.
Some have different opinions on which source of vacuum is best for a vacuum advance distributor, I like ported vacuum, a gradual increase with engine speed, which keeps the idle more stable, but gives good power in the midrange, allowing me to set my initial at idle higher than if I hooked up to full vacuum.
Full vacuum applied to the vacuum advance canister at idle will cause you to have a rough, unstable idle because your initial advance set at the balancer, plus the immediate vacuum advance operation as soon as the engine starts will give you way to much initial advance off the line, which will possibly cause detonation (pinging) at low rpms, even though as rpms increase, vacuum to the advance canister will decrease, then the distributor weights will take over the advancement to the total amount of advance you have your distributor dialed in for.

Did that make any sense? lol

And really, none of that applies to the '86-'93 5.0 engines with the EEC-IV management system. The computer signals the distributor when to advance the timing, although, you can advance the initial timing by unplugging the spout connector hanging from the wires at the distributor, engine off, loosen the distributor bolt some, start the engine, observe the timing marks at the balancer with a timing light, it should be 10 degrees initial, move the distributor clockwise to increase it to 12-14 degrees, counter-clockwise to decrease, turn off the engine, tighten the distributor bolt, re-start the engine to make sure the setting is where you had it before you shut the engine off, shut the engine off again, plug the spout connector back in, then the computer handles all timing advance from there, you're done.
A custom computer chip or program will tailor your advance curve after the initial distributor setting if that's what you need, otherwise, you're limited to the parameters of the stock EEC-IV management system.

Carbed engines are so much easier to deal with when it comes to getting what you need gradually as you modify your engine.

83GT306

Usually, you can advance until you hear spark knock, then back it off a couple degrees, but that depends on at what rpm you heard the spark knock. If you heard the knock at 4000 rpms, and you regularly rev your engine to 5000 rpms, back it off some.
Spark knock also has to do with fuel mixture and spark timing, there could be a lean spot at a certain rpm causing the spark knock even if your timing is optimized.
I wouldn't go too far past that initial 15 degrees though, it will cause hard starting. The spark will light waaaay before the piston reaches TDC, pushing down on the piston while it's still traveling upward. Initial timing has to do with compression ratio and cylinder pressure at cranking also.
That's why I don't see how any 2 engines can run efficiently with the same advertised form the factory initial timing setting, there are variances in every engine. Cylinder head combustion chamber sizes are not always equal or as advertised.
Initial timing setting depends on what "your" engine likes best.

Crazyfast50stang

would someone be able to explain how to set your timing in detail or tell me where I would be able to get the info. I hear good things about it and I want to do it but im completely lost on how to. Thanks

stanglx2002

Start the car and get it warmed up then hook up for timing light and attach the power wires to the - and + terminals then attach the other wire to the 1st spark plug wire. Then loosen the distributor hold down bolt so you can move it side to side. Next pull out the SPOUT connector and start the car. After the car is started point the timing timing light at the Harmonic Balancer to see what timing you are at and then turn the distributor clockwise until it pings then back it off about 2 degrees and then tuen the car off and tighten everything back down and put the SPOUT connector back in

83GT306

Most of it is explained right here in my previous response.

[And really, none of that applies to the '86-'93 5.0 engines with the EEC-IV management system. The computer signals the distributor when to advance the timing, although, you can advance the initial timing by unplugging the spout connector hanging from the wires at the distributor, engine off, loosen the distributor bolt some, start the engine, observe the timing marks at the balancer with a timing light, it should be 10 degrees initial, move the distributor clockwise to increase it to 12-14 degrees, counter-clockwise to decrease, turn off the engine, tighten the distributor bolt, re-start the engine to make sure the setting is where you had it before you shut the engine off, shut the engine off again, plug the spout connector back in, then the computer handles all timing advance from there, you're done.
A custom computer chip or program will tailor your advance curve after the initial distributor setting if that's what you need, otherwise, you're limited to the parameters of the stock EEC-IV management system.]

But, the distributor hold down bolt might be hard to get to if your engine has A/C.
If you still haven't figured it out from here, it might be best to have someone who knows to do it for you.
DON'T fool around unloosening the distributor bolt while the engine's running!! There are pullies and a belt turning, and not to mention the cooling fan!
Stanglx2002 has got you in the right direction, but you need to know "which" plug wire is the #1. Standing at the front of the car, to your left, the first cylinder towards you is the #1. Broken down, right side of engine from front to rear....#1 #2 #3 #4, left side of engine fromfront to rear....#5 #6 #7 #8. On the distributor cap there should be a #1 showing on the cap, from there, counter-clockwise, 13726548 is the firing order for a 5.0HO engine. On a regular old 302 engine, it's 15426378.

The marks on the balancer are in 2 degree increments. You will need to clean off these marks to be able to see them, even if you have to get on the ground to access the balancer to clean the marks. there will be a reference point for Top Dead Center, then there should be reference marks for After Top Dead Center, and Before Top Dead Center, you will want to go in the direction of BTDC when setting the marks while the engine is running. Turn your distributor in the needed direction while pointing the timing light at the pointer by the marks, while counting the marks from TDC toward BTDC. Try 12 degrees first, if it's good, leave it. Then move on to 14 degrees etc... You will be shutting off and retightening and replugging in the spout connector alot to achieve your best running condition, so make the time to do all of this. It's really easy, but don't rush and forget to tighten up or plug in afterwards.

Again, DON'T STICK YOUR HANDS IN THERE TO LOOSEN THE DISTRIBUTOR WHILE THE ENGINE IS RUNNING!!

Just use common sense when working around moving engine parts.

speedlvr

Anyone got a pic of where the spout connector is?