2011 Mustang GT makes 507rwhp N/A
#12
In my opinion if your gonna mod the car in search of HP to be around 500 rwhp or so....then whipple/twin screw FI is the way to go. Most of the time when driving normal the car seems stock and issue free, you only notice the HP/mod when the car is at WOT. Generally there are no problems with FI as far as tune issues and break downs occurring. The FI cars require little maintenance.
A lot of people I know, my experience and read about on the different forums with cams/heads on either the 4.6 3V or 5.0 are always having minor but, irritating problems. The problems are with idle, cel light on due to some tune issue, ran like crap yesterday but, running good today....who knows why?, or breaking parts. The car becomes more fickle and requires a lot of attention....which could be a PITA. For the most part we don't encounter these reoccurring issues when using the FI that makes responsible/reasonable HP.
A lot of people I know, my experience and read about on the different forums with cams/heads on either the 4.6 3V or 5.0 are always having minor but, irritating problems. The problems are with idle, cel light on due to some tune issue, ran like crap yesterday but, running good today....who knows why?, or breaking parts. The car becomes more fickle and requires a lot of attention....which could be a PITA. For the most part we don't encounter these reoccurring issues when using the FI that makes responsible/reasonable HP.
#13
What makes it not streetable or suitable for DD? it's not some aggresive cam, it's just a regrind on the stock cams, they say it even idles like stock, they are just ported stock heads. keep your rpms down and you wont be having the gobs of power it takes to break loose, I don't see how you guys can figure that.
As far as reliability of N/A vs F/I, i think this build looks more reliable than FI, but either can have their problems.
edit: nvm, i see you guys are saying not enough power downlow, you guys dont have the 6spds so i'll fill you in if you have 3.73s and if you shift it at 7500, where you are now making tons of power still with the new intake/heads/cams, you drop back in the perfect sweet spot for maximum power. So i dont see how that is bad for street use. gearing can always help you out if you need to be in the higher revs.
Or maybe i dont get what you are saying, like the idiot salesman at the dealership telling me my GT doesn't pull around town like their v6 torque monsters do because they somehow have more downlow power? i was like.. wtf are you guys smoking? i've heard that repeated by a bunch of v6 owners too.
As far as reliability of N/A vs F/I, i think this build looks more reliable than FI, but either can have their problems.
edit: nvm, i see you guys are saying not enough power downlow, you guys dont have the 6spds so i'll fill you in if you have 3.73s and if you shift it at 7500, where you are now making tons of power still with the new intake/heads/cams, you drop back in the perfect sweet spot for maximum power. So i dont see how that is bad for street use. gearing can always help you out if you need to be in the higher revs.
Or maybe i dont get what you are saying, like the idiot salesman at the dealership telling me my GT doesn't pull around town like their v6 torque monsters do because they somehow have more downlow power? i was like.. wtf are you guys smoking? i've heard that repeated by a bunch of v6 owners too.
Last edited by Mishri; 02-22-2011 at 07:23 PM.
#14
I actually discussed this in the trading in the camaro SS thread.
heads = 1500, cams=899, exhaust=1000, intake manifold=350, cai+tuner=600, total cost: 4349.
Plus, you can always had some n2o to the mix. I haven't seen any pricing on the superchargers but I expect them to be 5500+ but, i also expect the whipple puts out a lot more power considering they are getting low 10s with it.
heads = 1500, cams=899, exhaust=1000, intake manifold=350, cai+tuner=600, total cost: 4349.
Plus, you can always had some n2o to the mix. I haven't seen any pricing on the superchargers but I expect them to be 5500+ but, i also expect the whipple puts out a lot more power considering they are getting low 10s with it.
Ahhh there used cores for heads and regrinds on the cams or an additional $600 for new cams. That's not too bad.
Last edited by SpartaPerformance; 02-22-2011 at 08:27 PM.
#15
A regrind on a cam is a more aggressive cam or it won't make more power. The variable cam timing can tame some of the poor torque character out of it but only if it is not locked out which many cams require. More over lap causes a loss in low end but gain in top end.
I wish I had power curve chart to show you. The area under the curve is the power the engine makes at different rpms. So the more area under the curve the wider and more usable the power is the easier the power is to engage. SC cars have much more area under the curve.
Think of it this way which would you rather drive a 500 hp power 5 liter or 500 hp 7 liter? The hp is the same but the 7 liter will stomp the 5 and the SC is like the 7 liter.
I wish I had power curve chart to show you. The area under the curve is the power the engine makes at different rpms. So the more area under the curve the wider and more usable the power is the easier the power is to engage. SC cars have much more area under the curve.
Think of it this way which would you rather drive a 500 hp power 5 liter or 500 hp 7 liter? The hp is the same but the 7 liter will stomp the 5 and the SC is like the 7 liter.
#16
And if you pay someone else to do the exhaust ($1000 is a cheap one) and the cams? Aye carumba.
You are better off with the supercharger which is going to not only make more power but be the type of thing you can install on your own easier than fighting headers on a garage floor or dealing with cams and pulling cylinder heads.
These results are impressive but I honestly think the supercharger and leaving the rest of it alone is still a far better "value".
#17
#19
A regrind on a cam is a more aggressive cam or it won't make more power. The variable cam timing can tame some of the poor torque character out of it but only if it is not locked out which many cams require. More over lap causes a loss in low end but gain in top end.
I wish I had power curve chart to show you. The area under the curve is the power the engine makes at different rpms. So the more area under the curve the wider and more usable the power is the easier the power is to engage. SC cars have much more area under the curve.
Think of it this way which would you rather drive a 500 hp power 5 liter or 500 hp 7 liter? The hp is the same but the 7 liter will stomp the 5 and the SC is like the 7 liter.
I wish I had power curve chart to show you. The area under the curve is the power the engine makes at different rpms. So the more area under the curve the wider and more usable the power is the easier the power is to engage. SC cars have much more area under the curve.
Think of it this way which would you rather drive a 500 hp power 5 liter or 500 hp 7 liter? The hp is the same but the 7 liter will stomp the 5 and the SC is like the 7 liter.
5.0 DOHC vs 7.0 DOHC same bhp? i can't imagine how much that sucker would weigh, i'll vote for the 5.0 winning in the same vehicle.
Last edited by Mishri; 02-23-2011 at 04:30 PM.
#20
i agree completely with Mishri. I've had a supercharged vortech 2006 turning 430 rwhp and my current 5.0 at 410. The 2006 did snap your head back a little more but my current car is faster. It revs higher and has 6 gears. I'm also not afraid of detonation like i was with my 2006. Producing high horsepower at high revs allows me to take better advantage of gearing. That is as true on the street as at the track. Ferrari's turn excellent quarter mile times even though they don't produce a lot of torque. A supercharger and intercooler are going to weigh at least 70 pounds (Vortech) either right on your front axle or right in front of it in the case of a vortech or paxton. Not such a great idea on a nose heavy car. Also there is the issue of heat soak and the stress on the internals that forced induction produces that is absent in a cam regrind and enhanced breathing. JPC is getting the most out of the engine without adding weight or creating additional stress. naturally aspirated horsepower provided it is done correctly is vastly superior to slapping on a supercharger which is admittedly good for quarter mile times but not much else. I'm trying to lighten my front end not make it heavier. And show me the usable street tires that can handle all 600 pound feet of torque? Remember gentlemen at some point you have to turn the wheel. I prefer to do it without the extra weight on my front end, especially in this car. All around that horsepower and no weight added is the best deal going. and 480 pounds of torque and 583 flywheel horsepower on a 3600 pound car is more than enough to dominate on the street. I would bet that car can turn a quarter in the 11 on the stock Pirelli's. that is super super car performance and vastly superior to the Shelby.
2011 5.0, Kooks LTH, Kooks xpipe, Steeda CAI, brenspeed 91 oct tune, Koni STRT's, Steeda Spring, Forgestar F14, 24 pound wheels, Strano swaybars, barton Short throw shifter, Full Alcantara interior (410 RWHP, 380 RWT)
2011 5.0, Kooks LTH, Kooks xpipe, Steeda CAI, brenspeed 91 oct tune, Koni STRT's, Steeda Spring, Forgestar F14, 24 pound wheels, Strano swaybars, barton Short throw shifter, Full Alcantara interior (410 RWHP, 380 RWT)