Classic Mustangs (Tech) Technical discussions about the Mustangs of yester-year.

Stupid Cali Emissions

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Old Apr 23, 2006 | 02:08 PM
  #11  
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Default RE: Stupid Cali Emissions


ORIGINAL: clienterror

Scott is right TECHNICALLY they can fine you for anything that has to do with pollution control if it came stock. Here Illinois we dont have any checks or emissions tests and just about every Fox body has an off road H pipe with no cats. They CAN be fined for not having cats, but no one cares, they dont get under your car like in cali and stuff.

As far as removing the cali emissions....if your state didnt requre anything on that year/make in your state originally (I.E. smog pump, that kind of stuff) then I don't think you can be fined because if a cop pulls you over hes not going to decode your cars VIN and say it was a cali car wheres your emissions stuff at even tho it is a legal car for that year.

So basically with the Cali emissions crap on your legal in ALL 50 states. With it off your only legal in 49.

i dont have cat on mine im allergic to them!
Old Apr 23, 2006 | 02:40 PM
  #12  
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Default It's all about quality of the air we breathe


Any gain in performance you receive from removing the air injection pump is too small to be noticable. Figure, on average, it takes a 10% gain to get a "seat of the pants" feel. The air injection pump utilizes a max of 7 horse power (RPM dependent). That is why I said you'd have to have a pretty enemic engine to notice a difference.
If someone told you they removed the air injection pump and actually noticed a difference, they either had a bad air injection pump, a 70HP or less engine, or just *think* they actually have made a difference. All the air injection pump does is put air into the exhaust stream after the combustion process. It does nothing to lean out or interfere with the burn process. By injecting air into the hot exhaust gasses, it mostly dilutes what is coming out of the tail pipe, however it will also help burn some of the HC, so it does actually improve the exhaust gasses as well.

Here's a way to check for yourself:
Go for a drive to get the car all warmed up. Then do three 0-60mph runs over the same ground and time them. remove the belt for the air pump, and do the same thing. Compare the average times. Then you'll know for yourself. At that point do what ever you want. But at least be smart enough to prove it one way or the other to yourself.

Just my opinion (and a lot of personal experience), for what little gain you might see on a dyno chart, it's not worth the negatives. You could spend the time on something like curving your distributor, or doing a "test and tune" that will net you more gains, make your car more efficient, and lower your emissions all at the same time. I'm a firm believer in emission controls. Living in California, I've seen the dramatic impact it has had on our air quality.

Auto manufactures are building 400+ HP engines today that are incredibly efficient and offer exceptionally low emissions outputs. The ability for this to be adopted into the aftermarket and hot rod scene would be incredibly benificial to the future of our hobby. It's going to take inteligent people making inteligent choices now, before the some eco-nut starts making them for us. (IMO) It's time to quit living in the 80's and reap the benifits of modern technology.

BTW: Anybody notice we haven't helped this guy with his original question

YMMV,

Scott
Old Apr 23, 2006 | 06:51 PM
  #13  
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Default RE: It's all about quality of the air we breathe


ORIGINAL: Scott H.


Any gain in performance you receive from removing the air injection pump is too small to be noticable. Figure, on average, it takes a 10% gain to get a "seat of the pants" feel. The air injection pump utilizes a max of 7 horse power (RPM dependent). That is why I said you'd have to have a pretty enemic engine to notice a difference.
If someone told you they removed the air injection pump and actually noticed a difference, they either had a bad air injection pump, a 70HP or less engine, or just *think* they actually have made a difference. All the air injection pump does is put air into the exhaust stream after the combustion process. It does nothing to lean out or interfere with the burn process. By injecting air into the hot exhaust gasses, it mostly dilutes what is coming out of the tail pipe, however it will also help burn some of the HC, so it does actually improve the exhaust gasses as well.



BTW: Anybody notice we haven't helped this guy with his original question

YMMV,

Scott
I'm pretty sure mine is probably pretty bad after 40 years but call that a wild guess. Is that what the Cali Emissions really is though, an air injection pump? I had never heard the real term.
Old Apr 23, 2006 | 06:57 PM
  #14  
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Default RE: It's all about quality of the air we breathe

if you have that i dont think it would be 40 years old because in california cars made before 1974 dont require anything to do with emissions (besides the regular muffler and stuff). no smog or catalytic converter or anything. im a little bit confused on why anyone would add emissions things but whatever.
Old Apr 23, 2006 | 07:14 PM
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Default RE: It's all about quality of the air we breathe

They dont require them for tests now but they put them on back then
Old Apr 23, 2006 | 08:23 PM
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Default RE: It's all about quality of the air we breathe

BTW: Anybody notice we haven't helped this guy with his original question
95% of us guys don't own a Kali emission controlled classic Scott. What I mentioned, was for him to do some research and talk to vendors about how to make the change over. Yeah, you are probably right about the pump not taking away much HP, but it is an ugly thing that most restomods guys want to take off just for appearance of the engine bay if for nothing else. You mentioned the moder cars and the emissions quality of them. I agree....but, back in the 60's those antequated systems only helped a little bit. Not near the same emsissions quality of equipment we now enjoy on our modern cars.
Old Apr 23, 2006 | 09:37 PM
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Default RE: It's all about quality of the air we breathe

But every little bit helps!
Old Apr 23, 2006 | 10:16 PM
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ORIGINAL: Scott H.

But every little bit helps!
+1
Old Apr 23, 2006 | 10:22 PM
  #19  
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ORIGINAL: Scott H.

But every little bit helps!
Just curious, did you put that stuff back on when you rebuilt your engine?
Old Apr 23, 2006 | 11:23 PM
  #20  
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Default RE: It's all about quality of the air we breathe

I haven't rebuilt the engine, it is still as stock as the day it came from the factory. All I've done is some proper tuning and blue printing of the distributor and carb to make it run a little better than they did off the show room floor.
Most likely next winter, I will be changing it out for a V8. You can rest assured that the engine going in will meet or exceed the emission requirements for the year of the engine (a California requirement). Seeing as I'm looking at early 90's 5.0 but with 2000 technology EFI/spark management, to include cats' it won't be a problem. Actually when compared pound for pound of exhaust gasses, the new V8 will be much cleaner then the old straight 6.
No reason not to have 350+ HP with 23 mpg average, and drivability of a new car, when everything is readily available and reasonably priced.
That way, hopefully, no Eco-**** can mess with my day. [sm=icon_cheers.gif]



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