Are you planning on doing anything in that cage Dave, or is is it fuctional ? I don't wanna pick on you, but you are giving ideas that aren't legal, and are kinda dangerous.

 

Please explain....

Thanks,
Dave

 

Actually, I'm not really going to be taking this to the track to be running anything crazy but I've got a friend whos does a fevx concept designs here and there and we had a few ideas on mine and we were going to implement a small roll bar i guess, not a full on roll cage my mistake, so Dave's look is awesome so thanks Dave. The whole door opening-bar deal Im gonna agree doesnt look the safest but cool idea just the same. We were kinda for may an idea like what's in the general lee, how it seems almost stock and real smooth. We want to be able to still integrate the interior panels along with it.

 

Home welders aren't the best for this sort of thing. They don't get got enough to penetrate the metal. In an accident it won't hold.
The bars have to meet the floors with plates. With metal as thin as a floor, a perfect weld won't hold the bar to the floor. It'll tear it out. That's what the plate is for. To spread the force out along the floor.
You aren't aloud to grind down welds. The inspector needs to see the quality of weld, and check for porosity.
The back bars while not illegal, would be better served in a leaf spring car to go all the way back to the back of the leaf spring mount.
The forward bars are illegal. They should travel between your should and elbow while hands on the wheel. This makes the bar come forward, and is what keeps you in the car if something goes wrong.
Your crossbar in the hoop is too high. It needs to be 4in I believe below the shoulder that way the seat belt angles down. If it's too high, in an accident it will let your shoulders come forward to your knees and break your back.
Rule books are made from years of testing and others mistakes. If it's a purely show car, then none of it matters. Again, don't wanna pick on you. just don't want people to think its acceptable for anything other than show.

 

I have one....New for this year.







Safety first.....It's a pain in the but getting in and out with the down bars.

 

can i get some details on just a strait up roll bar? my mom is really concerned about safety and wants me to get one. problem is, she decided after the interior resto... gah. so how hard is it to install one, and how much would a shop charge?

 

You can say that again! The rollbar was more of an afterthought than anything else. I strongly encourage anyone who is contemplating installing one to do a lot of reading/researching beforehand.

The main hoop and rear bars of my rollbar ARE welded straight to the one-piece 2x3 fully boxed frame. I had to cut holes in the floor of the car to get the bars solidly centered and welded onto the frame.

Yep, 100% correct. My "home-built" cage will not have to pass any sanctioning bodies inspectors. It's purely for my own enjoyment.

They do pass between my shoulder and elbow with hands on the wheel.... If you're looking at the second photo I posted, that was just a "trial fit" during the mock up process and that bar was removed. In this below photo, although the rear of the bar is a little higher than it probably should be, the bar passes between my "high" shoulder and elbow with hands on the wheel. I mocked it up in every position imaginable before deciding that this was the lesser of all evils. The bar is far enough away from my head while providing maximum side impact protection....




The crossbar is definitely too high for any sanctioning body, but I disagree that with it mounted this high that itwon't adequately restrain the shoulders in the event of a frontal impact. I'm not saying I'm right, just that I disagree. If the crossbar was mounted 4" below the shoulders, what would prevent the shoulder straps from falling off of the sides of my shoulders? Kind of like the lady who's always pulling her bra strap up off of her arm.... By having the straps mounted directly behind my shoulders, the straps stay firmly in place on my shoulders. There is some differing opinions on spinal compression with straps that are mounted significantly below the shoulders. Instead of the straps holding the shoulders "back" in a frontal, they would force the shoulders "down", possibly causing spinal compression type damage. Which new car have you riden in lately where the shoulderbelt mounting point is 4" below your shoulder? Regardless of all this, I mocked it up the way I thought it would work best "for me". It may not be an approved configuration, but it works for me.


Very good point and I'm glad you mentioned it. By no meanswould my rollbar pass the tests of any sanctioning body. I read the rule books and made alterations to suit my personal preferences. All of the welds are fully penetrated, but yes I did dress some of the welds. I feel100% confident that bar as it is, is far superior than having no bar at all. If I'm ever in an accident that tests the strength and design of the rollbar, I'm confident that I stand a far better chance with it, than without it.

I very much so appreciate your professional input!

Dave

 

I know that you and I have "agreed to disagree" and don't see eye to eye on some things, but if your Mom is really concerned about safety, you should probably park the Mustang and never drive it again....

To get a 45 year old car (48 year old design) up to any modern safety standards is nearly impossible....

ABS? Good luck with that one!

PassiveRestraint System/Airbags? I haven't seen it done on a classic Mustang.....ever.... and I've been working on them along time.

4 wheel disc brakes? Definitely do-able, but break out your wallet.

Baffled fuel cell? Again do-able, but again more big$,$$$.$$

Crush zones? Figure that one out....

How aboutwhat should be her biggest concern? Your steering column.Unless it has been replaced with a 67 (or later) collapsible unitwill turn into the ole "spear-o-matic" and impale you in the event of a hard frontal impact. Without shoulder belts, you'll probably never feel it though as you would have already been rendered unconscious.

The bottom line is that these cars cannot be brought into any semblance of "safety" compared to modern vehicles without spending a lot of money... and even then will never be as safe as a 2004 Ford Focus.

Just tell Mom that you like "living on the edge"...

LOL,
Dave

 

Our tech regs are +/- 10 degrees from horizontal at shoulder height. but its going to depend on the size of the seat occupant.

I would suggest one of 2 things to ensure the belts dont slip sideways at a critical time.
1) swap them so they cross over or
2) better yet, collar the crossbar so they stay fixed in the right position.

if you hit hard enough to create a spinal compression issue chances are you will submarine under the lap belt and break your neck[&:]

FWIW i dont think that bar will offer a lot of side intrusion protection.One of the best defences is to build new seat mounting railsgoing sideways between the sill panel frame and the tunnel. If you get a smack in the side theseat is moved away from the point of impact.

 

Haha, ya, she wont accept that... She understands that it is something i really enjoy having and is therefore able to deal with its danger, but I might as well make it as safe as I can. As far as most of those 'big $$$' items, she has agreed to pay for safety upgrades on the car. Still, not sure if she will go for it if its gonna be 5k, and I wont go for it if they will mess up the interior or anything. 3 point belts and highback seats are already in, and brakes are next...

and hey, if I die in my mustang, at least she will know I died happy!