urban_cowboy

I have been off the boards for a while. Work and life always seem to get in the way. Heck, Red Whiskey has not even been out of the garage but twice since new years. As I posted last time, I am working on a Top Sportsman 8.00-7.50 sec 1/4 mile car. I am building it off a '69 Mach 1 Fastback (of course...my favorite) that was cut up years ago for a Super Gas car. Like many other things, I have a pile of parts to build the chassis but have not had to time to start burning them together. yet

As I day dream of finishing my project and racing on the weekends in a classic tube chassis mustang, I have been shopping for cylinder heads. I have a free custom grind Comp Cam I need to use too, but every thing really depends on the heads. I scored a Dart Iron Eagle 9.5" deck 4.125 bore block I picked up new still in box full of dust for a very good deal. The rotating assembly will be a 4.125 bore 4.00 stroke to make for 427ci. Compression will be 15:1 running obviously on race gas. The over all plans are to hit 800-850hp NA spinning to about 8500. Once the kinks are all worked out, I am going to add two stage of nitrous to get the car in the Top Sportsman high 7s range.

Now finally to my question. What cylinder heads to get? The sky is the limit right now. I have been in talks with AFR to have a custom set of 220 heads made (angle milled) and prepped for large Manley roller cam springs. I am not convinced these are what I need/want. I have a nice set of 205s that I like on my 383, but AFR does not seem to be very racer friendly, which does not instill much confidence. Any other suggestions? Kaase/CHI? I am not super familiar with them or the hassles of Clevor motors. I know the C400 makes some wicked flow numbers and CHI always seems to be in the running in the Engine Master Championship. Yates heads? I have never found much info on a solid CNC version/source for them but the name is legendary. Dart Heads also has what looks to be a nice set of 225cc CNC heads that match up pretty close to AFR from what I can tell.

Intake is not an issue as i am going to build a sheet metal intake for this. Exhaust is not an issue as this will be a custom header in a tube chassis setup. Just want to see if anyone has any experience with large displacement small block heads and what they do or do not suggest.

Thanks,

urban_cowboy

Finished speaking with AFR. They graciously bowed out. They think I need a head that will flow 375-400cfm in more of a 240-250cc setup to hit the numbers I am looking for. He recommended looking at Edelbrock Victor Glidden heads. They look to be similar to the Yates stuff but not much information out there. Also read a few posts on some racing sites talking about the big high port Trick Flow heads.

BuckeyeDemon

this thread discusses a yates C3 head with some work getting up to those power levels using a .825" lift cam.

http://speedtalk.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=149955

Starfury

Good to see you back, Urban. I'll be following this thread

69FB

Urban you should try Patriot Performance. I know they are heavy into racing and from what I've heard/read they make some nice high flowing heads.

urban_cowboy

My IHRA official buddy is doing some calling around. So far, Trick Flow 240 heads ported from Total Engine Airflow has been the best suggestion. I have never been a big fan of TF as that is all I hear from the 5.0 guys and their stuff sounds like smoke and mirrors, but the 240 numbers do look good. DynoSim is estimating 844 Fly Hp at 7500 with the custom Cam Comp is suggesting.

The other name that was dropped is Kuntz and Company. I do not know much about them, and their website is pretty plain. That does really mean much though.

I think I will call Jon Kaase this morning and see what he/they suggest.

Anyone familar with the World Products Man O War heads? The 10* heads look like they might work, especially with the CNC program.

Any other ideas? Any ideas who/where to ask?

Apparently, this build is going to be stretching the limits of a small block from the head perspective. That shocks me because at a 427, I still go to a 434ci in this block with a little more bore and a 460 with a little more stroke. I just assumed some folks were building big heads for these big Ford small blocks. I was looking at the Kaase P51 heads and got all excited until I realized they were 428/460 BBF heads.

Starfury

What's wrong with Trick Flow? The Twisted Wedge design really is a good idea (unshrouds the valves), and I'm quite happy with mine. I can't vouch for their capacity to flow the kind of numbers you're looking for, but they work great on small-cube small blocks.

I'd think the Man O' War heads would be a good starting point, considering the World Products Man O' War blocks can be punched out and stroked to the same point your iron eagle block can be.

eZ

Urban, good to see you on here...

I would call Patrick over at ProSystems carbs. He builds carbs for all those top sportsman guys and is very invovled...I think he even does a lot of the head porting. I also know Ed Curtis does a lot of head work but I think Pat is more on the race scene. The only race guys I know are top fuel guys and I doubt you want their heads lol!

urban_cowboy

I spoke with 3 different Ford engine guys who have played in the Top Sportsman and Outlaw 10.5 arenas. All of them said my only option was World ManOWar or find someone to run a custom CNC job on a set of Edelbrock Victor Glidden race heads. I had very little luck finding anyone I trusted to run a CNC program on the VG heads, so I am thinking Man O War. Star, there is nothing really wrong with TF heads. I personally have not ever run them, but I could not find anyone who had run them in a large small block. It seems they own the 5.0 market though.

I am about 90% committed to selling my Dart Iron Eagle block and getting a World Man O War block, a set of their 10* heads, and having them run their 310cc CNC program on it. Their "-4" package is still a little light as far as springs and a little lowend as far as their valves, but it will work for shake down. I can always upgrade to Manley springs and Titanium valves after a few races.

I posted the Dart block on racingjunk if anyone is interested.

The custom grind Comp Cam is on order. I do not have valve events, but the general specs are 285/295 duration @ .050 .799/.785 lift @ 1.7 and 112 lobe center line which is a little low for nitrous, but I do not want to kill it if I decide to just run on motor for while.

If anyone has run Man O War heads, please chime in.

Starfury

A side note on the Man O' War block: my friend's brother has one in his '69 Mach I and ran into some header clearance issues with it. The block is designed with some extra webbing under the exhaust ports to accommodate more than the factory number of head bolts for use with their special heads. This webbing gets in the way a bit when you're trying to fit out-of-the-box headers. He had to modify his to fit.

From the scale of your project, I'm sure this won't be a problem for you, especially since you'll need special headers already. Thought you might want to know beforehand, though