new on the Mustangs...sorta
08-25-2005, 11:13 PM
#1
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 6
new on the Mustangs...sorta
ok, I'll start out by saying that I am not currently a Mustang owner. I have been working on and building cars for a bit mostly having to do with smaller displacements and cylinder numbers. I am considering a couple of paths on the whole Mustang issue and here is where I am at right now.
Stuation A. I have a friend with a late model, I believe about a 98, Mustang V6. We have been collaborating around a 65,000 mile 5.4l OHC from a 2001 F150 that I have in my possesion. He has mentioned an interest in that it can be converted to the quad cam version and built for some nice power then, with the appropriate work, installed into his Mustang. As he will be paying me for use of my shop, my tools and knowledge on autos. The first obvios question for me is, where can I get good information on whether this can be done and how? As I understand it, the Cobra R have a 5.4l displacement as well as a whole lot more additions. Which leads me to belive that it could be done. Should this take place I am planning on using the proceeds to purchase a pre 93 notchback Mustang 5.0 to build up.
Situation B. The above mentioned plan falls through and I purchase a late model V6 and do the conversion myself for my own benefit.
I would like some information and comments on these mentioned situations along with some good resources for finding the information myself.
I realize this is kind of a strange introduction. I am howeve serious about taking one of these paths.
btw...I'm Mike and I am in North Little Rock, Arkansas for the time being and I work as a federal technician.
nice to be here [sm=americanasmiley.gif]
Stuation A. I have a friend with a late model, I believe about a 98, Mustang V6. We have been collaborating around a 65,000 mile 5.4l OHC from a 2001 F150 that I have in my possesion. He has mentioned an interest in that it can be converted to the quad cam version and built for some nice power then, with the appropriate work, installed into his Mustang. As he will be paying me for use of my shop, my tools and knowledge on autos. The first obvios question for me is, where can I get good information on whether this can be done and how? As I understand it, the Cobra R have a 5.4l displacement as well as a whole lot more additions. Which leads me to belive that it could be done. Should this take place I am planning on using the proceeds to purchase a pre 93 notchback Mustang 5.0 to build up.
Situation B. The above mentioned plan falls through and I purchase a late model V6 and do the conversion myself for my own benefit.
I would like some information and comments on these mentioned situations along with some good resources for finding the information myself.
I realize this is kind of a strange introduction. I am howeve serious about taking one of these paths.
btw...I'm Mike and I am in North Little Rock, Arkansas for the time being and I work as a federal technician.
nice to be here [sm=americanasmiley.gif]
08-29-2005, 02:02 PM
#5
RE: new on the Mustangs...sorta
I am doing a 2003 Mach1 swap into my 1995 Mustang V6, it is a big project but not really a problem at all. It is a DOHC 4.6L engine and the same size I believe as the 5.4L so size in the engine bay isnt an issue. I believe it uses the same mounting points as well but dont take my word for that, Im just going on that Ford likes to do the same thing with all their identical design engines.
Now as for getting it into the latemodel V6 well you will need a new K-Member for that and you can purchase an incredibly strong, lightweight and spaceous (More header room) QA1 front suspension kit and K-Member. You also might concider the Manual Rack from Flaming river to drop another 70ish lbs and gain a few ponies on the engine. In all with the manual rack and QA1 conversion you should have saved 150lbs off your front already. The better coil over suspension geometry will make it more fun to drive on winding roads or on a circuit track.
Its definatly possible, just give QA1 a call to make sure that the engine will bolt to their K-Frame.
From there you have to mount your trans and then get a driveshaft, you might need a new driveshaft, if that is the case then you should check out PST (Precision Shaft Technologies) and get one of their 11lbs TOTAL carbon fiber driveshafts. They are about $709 dollars for a stock measurement and if they have to make it custom I think its only another couple hundred. There was a person that tested this driveshaft and got about 11mph faster times down the 1/4 mile and about 17 more ponies because of the lesser rotating mass.
If you are going to go that way then I suggest a lightweight billit aluminum flywheel so you can get a little more power and throttle response out of her.
For your rear end you are going to have to upgrade to an 8.8" out of a GT or Cobra mustang. I wouldnt go with IRS just because it is alot heavier and the half shafts break easily. Try to go for a 94-01 Cobra rear for the much larger disk brakes. I know 94-98 for sure but I am not sure if 99-01 had IRS yet.
From there you are going to need more bite to the ground so you need to invest in some weightjacker lower controll arms and tubular upper controll arms then you can remove the quad shocks and brackets to save about 20lbs.
Now because of the increased torque and bite to the ground you need to beef up your torque boxes. Go get a set of upper and lower battle boxes and weld/bolt them into place. This will keep the subframe happen and you wont pull your car apart.
We got a 94' Mustang GT into our yard with only 118k on the odo, the car looked perfect and we werent sure why we got it. As I was removing the rear end I saw why, the lower controll arms had pulled the rear panel under the rear seat away from the car and it was a big enough space to ALMOST stick your hand through and shake someones hand inside the car. The whole rear of the car was separating from the mid section.
From that point inspect all your spot welds and lay your own beads down for extra strength, you will also need subframe connectors to keep the chasis from flexing under load.
Hmmm I think thats about it, the rest is up to you and your taste.
Later.
-Eric-
Now as for getting it into the latemodel V6 well you will need a new K-Member for that and you can purchase an incredibly strong, lightweight and spaceous (More header room) QA1 front suspension kit and K-Member. You also might concider the Manual Rack from Flaming river to drop another 70ish lbs and gain a few ponies on the engine. In all with the manual rack and QA1 conversion you should have saved 150lbs off your front already. The better coil over suspension geometry will make it more fun to drive on winding roads or on a circuit track.
Its definatly possible, just give QA1 a call to make sure that the engine will bolt to their K-Frame.
From there you have to mount your trans and then get a driveshaft, you might need a new driveshaft, if that is the case then you should check out PST (Precision Shaft Technologies) and get one of their 11lbs TOTAL carbon fiber driveshafts. They are about $709 dollars for a stock measurement and if they have to make it custom I think its only another couple hundred. There was a person that tested this driveshaft and got about 11mph faster times down the 1/4 mile and about 17 more ponies because of the lesser rotating mass.
If you are going to go that way then I suggest a lightweight billit aluminum flywheel so you can get a little more power and throttle response out of her.
For your rear end you are going to have to upgrade to an 8.8" out of a GT or Cobra mustang. I wouldnt go with IRS just because it is alot heavier and the half shafts break easily. Try to go for a 94-01 Cobra rear for the much larger disk brakes. I know 94-98 for sure but I am not sure if 99-01 had IRS yet.
From there you are going to need more bite to the ground so you need to invest in some weightjacker lower controll arms and tubular upper controll arms then you can remove the quad shocks and brackets to save about 20lbs.
Now because of the increased torque and bite to the ground you need to beef up your torque boxes. Go get a set of upper and lower battle boxes and weld/bolt them into place. This will keep the subframe happen and you wont pull your car apart.
We got a 94' Mustang GT into our yard with only 118k on the odo, the car looked perfect and we werent sure why we got it. As I was removing the rear end I saw why, the lower controll arms had pulled the rear panel under the rear seat away from the car and it was a big enough space to ALMOST stick your hand through and shake someones hand inside the car. The whole rear of the car was separating from the mid section.
From that point inspect all your spot welds and lay your own beads down for extra strength, you will also need subframe connectors to keep the chasis from flexing under load.
Hmmm I think thats about it, the rest is up to you and your taste.
Later.
-Eric-
08-29-2005, 02:43 PM
#6
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 6
RE: new on the Mustangs...sorta
thanks for the good info....that will get me a long way towards setting the final plan....it seems like it will be a hell of a job and I hope the benefits will weigh out for the work...the only thing I had heard was that I might have some hood clearance issues....but I will contact the places you mentioned so I can complete the outline and make it clear for my friend or me, whoever we do this for
08-29-2005, 06:46 PM
#7
4th Gear Member
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Assachusetts
Posts: 1,899
RE: new on the Mustangs...sorta
ORIGINAL: NeoTokyo
I am doing a 2003 Mach1 swap into my 1995 Mustang V6, it is a big project but not really a problem at all. It is a DOHC 4.6L engine and the same size I believe as the 5.4L so size in the engine bay isnt an issue. I believe it uses the same mounting points as well but dont take my word for that, Im just going on that Ford likes to do the same thing with all their identical design engines.
Now as for getting it into the latemodel V6 well you will need a new K-Member for that and you can purchase an incredibly strong, lightweight and spaceous (More header room) QA1 front suspension kit and K-Member. You also might concider the Manual Rack from Flaming river to drop another 70ish lbs and gain a few ponies on the engine. In all with the manual rack and QA1 conversion you should have saved 150lbs off your front already. The better coil over suspension geometry will make it more fun to drive on winding roads or on a circuit track.
Its definatly possible, just give QA1 a call to make sure that the engine will bolt to their K-Frame.
From there you have to mount your trans and then get a driveshaft, you might need a new driveshaft, if that is the case then you should check out PST (Precision Shaft Technologies) and get one of their 11lbs TOTAL carbon fiber driveshafts. They are about $709 dollars for a stock measurement and if they have to make it custom I think its only another couple hundred. There was a person that tested this driveshaft and got about 11mph faster times down the 1/4 mile and about 17 more ponies because of the lesser rotating mass.
If you are going to go that way then I suggest a lightweight billit aluminum flywheel so you can get a little more power and throttle response out of her.
For your rear end you are going to have to upgrade to an 8.8" out of a GT or Cobra mustang. I wouldnt go with IRS just because it is alot heavier and the half shafts break easily. Try to go for a 94-01 Cobra rear for the much larger disk brakes. I know 94-98 for sure but I am not sure if 99-01 had IRS yet.
From there you are going to need more bite to the ground so you need to invest in some weightjacker lower controll arms and tubular upper controll arms then you can remove the quad shocks and brackets to save about 20lbs.Now because of the increased torque and bite to the ground you need to beef up your torque boxes. Go get a set of upper and lower battle boxes and weld/bolt them into place. This will keep the subframe happen and you wont pull your car apart.
We got a 94' Mustang GT into our yard with only 118k on the odo, the car looked perfect and we werent sure why we got it. As I was removing the rear end I saw why, the lower controll arms had pulled the rear panel under the rear seat away from the car and it was a big enough space to ALMOST stick your hand through and shake someones hand inside the car. The whole rear of the car was separating from the mid section.
From that point inspect all your spot welds and lay your own beads down for extra strength, you will also need subframe connectors to keep the chasis from flexing under load.
Hmmm I think thats about it, the rest is up to you and your taste.
Later.
-Eric-
I am doing a 2003 Mach1 swap into my 1995 Mustang V6, it is a big project but not really a problem at all. It is a DOHC 4.6L engine and the same size I believe as the 5.4L so size in the engine bay isnt an issue. I believe it uses the same mounting points as well but dont take my word for that, Im just going on that Ford likes to do the same thing with all their identical design engines.
Now as for getting it into the latemodel V6 well you will need a new K-Member for that and you can purchase an incredibly strong, lightweight and spaceous (More header room) QA1 front suspension kit and K-Member. You also might concider the Manual Rack from Flaming river to drop another 70ish lbs and gain a few ponies on the engine. In all with the manual rack and QA1 conversion you should have saved 150lbs off your front already. The better coil over suspension geometry will make it more fun to drive on winding roads or on a circuit track.
Its definatly possible, just give QA1 a call to make sure that the engine will bolt to their K-Frame.
From there you have to mount your trans and then get a driveshaft, you might need a new driveshaft, if that is the case then you should check out PST (Precision Shaft Technologies) and get one of their 11lbs TOTAL carbon fiber driveshafts. They are about $709 dollars for a stock measurement and if they have to make it custom I think its only another couple hundred. There was a person that tested this driveshaft and got about 11mph faster times down the 1/4 mile and about 17 more ponies because of the lesser rotating mass.
If you are going to go that way then I suggest a lightweight billit aluminum flywheel so you can get a little more power and throttle response out of her.
For your rear end you are going to have to upgrade to an 8.8" out of a GT or Cobra mustang. I wouldnt go with IRS just because it is alot heavier and the half shafts break easily. Try to go for a 94-01 Cobra rear for the much larger disk brakes. I know 94-98 for sure but I am not sure if 99-01 had IRS yet.
From there you are going to need more bite to the ground so you need to invest in some weightjacker lower controll arms and tubular upper controll arms then you can remove the quad shocks and brackets to save about 20lbs.Now because of the increased torque and bite to the ground you need to beef up your torque boxes. Go get a set of upper and lower battle boxes and weld/bolt them into place. This will keep the subframe happen and you wont pull your car apart.
We got a 94' Mustang GT into our yard with only 118k on the odo, the car looked perfect and we werent sure why we got it. As I was removing the rear end I saw why, the lower controll arms had pulled the rear panel under the rear seat away from the car and it was a big enough space to ALMOST stick your hand through and shake someones hand inside the car. The whole rear of the car was separating from the mid section.
From that point inspect all your spot welds and lay your own beads down for extra strength, you will also need subframe connectors to keep the chasis from flexing under load.
Hmmm I think thats about it, the rest is up to you and your taste.
Later.
-Eric-
I started high lighting things you dont need to do this swap but you pretty much dont need al the parts he listed.....To build the ultimate street car it would be nice to have all that stuff but jees....that would cost a fortune!!!!Youd be way better off to buy a cobra R...He just listed every performance part made and expensive ones also.What you want to do could be done with all stock parts such as K frame flywheel,A -arms,lower control arms all that **** could stay stock.He just built his dream car on your budget.The drive shaft could be a stock one thats shortened up or lentheend if worse came to worse.The K frame from a V6 will work also all youd need is the motor mounts.What he stated above would be great if your rich as can be and want to waste a TON of money but why not just buy a sick mustang thats done already cause what he just said would end up costing 50,000 grand
08-30-2005, 01:11 AM
#8
RE: new on the Mustangs...sorta
50G's? Yah right!
I already priced all this stuff for my own car and I am only going to invest a total of 12G's into it. I already have 5G's out of the way so I have gotten a great start.
Just having the engine and stroker kit and trans is an awesome start, not to mention the whole front end/k-Frame/suspension and I got my GT Rear end.
You have to shop frugally and barder with people, dont always stand on the first price said.
I didnt build my dream car on his budget, I AM building MY dream car on MY budget and just told him what I am doing and all the idea's that I have planned for mine.
I make $8.24 an hour and make about $100 extra dollars a month in bonuses, If I can build my car on that kind of budget then anyone can!
This man seems like he knows how to build a car (For Fugzz sake he owns a Shop!) so labor wont cost him a buttload.
And when it all comes down to the line, a man that built his 500hp NA engine will always have more pride and accomplishment in his car then the man that paid for his 500hp Na engine.
I like to tell people that I do all my own work on my car because it gives me pride, I know several Cobra guys around here that say "I dont even change my plug wires because of how complicated my car is" and I just knod and smile because I know that I have seen my cylender walls, I have held my piston and I have stepped back at my work and had the largest Sh*t eatin grin on my face because I did it and I did it right.
Now for all the tollerances in an engine and ballance and blueprinting I leave that to the pro's or my dad depending on who is available at the time, my dad is in Missouri right now so its The Throttle Stop in Rocklin for now.
Anyways, im out I have to pull Aprils C6 out of her Mach.
-Eric-
I already priced all this stuff for my own car and I am only going to invest a total of 12G's into it. I already have 5G's out of the way so I have gotten a great start.
Just having the engine and stroker kit and trans is an awesome start, not to mention the whole front end/k-Frame/suspension and I got my GT Rear end.
You have to shop frugally and barder with people, dont always stand on the first price said.
I didnt build my dream car on his budget, I AM building MY dream car on MY budget and just told him what I am doing and all the idea's that I have planned for mine.
I make $8.24 an hour and make about $100 extra dollars a month in bonuses, If I can build my car on that kind of budget then anyone can!
This man seems like he knows how to build a car (For Fugzz sake he owns a Shop!) so labor wont cost him a buttload.
And when it all comes down to the line, a man that built his 500hp NA engine will always have more pride and accomplishment in his car then the man that paid for his 500hp Na engine.
I like to tell people that I do all my own work on my car because it gives me pride, I know several Cobra guys around here that say "I dont even change my plug wires because of how complicated my car is" and I just knod and smile because I know that I have seen my cylender walls, I have held my piston and I have stepped back at my work and had the largest Sh*t eatin grin on my face because I did it and I did it right.
Now for all the tollerances in an engine and ballance and blueprinting I leave that to the pro's or my dad depending on who is available at the time, my dad is in Missouri right now so its The Throttle Stop in Rocklin for now.
Anyways, im out I have to pull Aprils C6 out of her Mach.
-Eric-
08-30-2005, 02:09 PM
#10
4th Gear Member
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Assachusetts
Posts: 1,899
RE: new on the Mustangs...sorta
I also do all my own work but it still not cheap....Everything is expensive!SO you make 8.24 an hour and your going to buy a 700 dollar drive shaft?????Why no shaft is giving you 11 MPH That i can guarantee.Dont get me wrong all the stuff you listed is nice but by the time you buy the car and all the stuff for it your going to have some serious money into it.When i said buy a car thats done I meant one that runs and has some work already and go from there it will save you a boatload of money