What should I do to make it run Cooler ?
10-12-2006, 02:20 AM
#11
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Join Date: Mar 2006
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RE: What should I do to make it run Cooler ?
ORIGINAL: fordfanboy
Another quick suggestion is to reprogram your tune to make your fan run all the time while driving.
Another quick suggestion is to reprogram your tune to make your fan run all the time while driving.
NNNOOOOO DON'T DO THAT....!!!!! you will burn the motor up in your fan.. and I would bet that motor costs a few $$$$$
Rex
10-12-2006, 02:28 AM
#12
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Join Date: Mar 2006
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RE: What should I do to make it run Cooler ?
You may be right about the stock thermostat temp. I had heard it was 195 (typical for many cars) but I am not 100% sure about that. OEM thermostats are usually pretty hot for efficiency reasons (see later)
Anyway, the whole point of the thermostat is to regulate the engine temperature. A "low temp" thermostat makes the engine run cooler becasue it opens up at a lower temperature, allowing the radiator to be utilized sooner and more often.
Think of it this way: The thermostat is like "the boss" that attempts to set the engine's temp. When the engine is too cold (at startup, for example) the thermostat is closed. This prevents coolant from circulating into the radiator. The coolant stays inside the engine and the whole assembly warms up quickly. As the engine hits the specified temp, the thermostat begins to open. The hotter it gets, the more it opens up. If the engine is "too hot" the thermostat is open all the way, allowing the radiator to get rid of the extra heat. As the engine cools down, the thermostat begins to close, decreasing radiator flow, and ideally settling at a happy medium. During ideal operating conditions, the thermostat will be partially open and the engine will be at (or very close to) the specified temp. The thermostat has varying degrees of "open and closed" to account for different ambient conditions. For example, in the winter the thermostat might be barely cracked open, and in the middle of the summer it might be open quite a bit. But the whole point is that the thermostat is supposed to regulate the engine's temp by throttling the coolant flow through the radiator--the same way the thermostat in your house turns the AC on and off as needed.
If your thermostat is open all the way and the engine is hotter than the specified temp, that is a sign that the cooling system is not working properly for some reason. For example: poor water flow, a clogged radiator, too small of a radiator, no air flow through the radiator, etc. Another possibility is that the ambient conditions are too extreme (for example, you're in the middle of the desert at 110 degrees--though, this is technically a case of "too small radiator")
So yes, if everything is working as it should, you could put in a 160 degree thermostat, set your fans at a similar temp, and have your engine running at 160.
BUT you probably wouldn't want to do that. The efficiency of any heat-cycle engine is directly related to it's operating temperature. A hotter engine is more efficicent and burns cleaner. Also, oil becomes thicker at lower temps. Your oil pumping losses and friction go up as well. A "cold engine" is good for raw power (drag strip, for example), but it is poor for mileage. And in all cases you don't want to "beat on" your engine until it's up to temp and the oil is flowing.
Anyway, the whole point of the thermostat is to regulate the engine temperature. A "low temp" thermostat makes the engine run cooler becasue it opens up at a lower temperature, allowing the radiator to be utilized sooner and more often.
Think of it this way: The thermostat is like "the boss" that attempts to set the engine's temp. When the engine is too cold (at startup, for example) the thermostat is closed. This prevents coolant from circulating into the radiator. The coolant stays inside the engine and the whole assembly warms up quickly. As the engine hits the specified temp, the thermostat begins to open. The hotter it gets, the more it opens up. If the engine is "too hot" the thermostat is open all the way, allowing the radiator to get rid of the extra heat. As the engine cools down, the thermostat begins to close, decreasing radiator flow, and ideally settling at a happy medium. During ideal operating conditions, the thermostat will be partially open and the engine will be at (or very close to) the specified temp. The thermostat has varying degrees of "open and closed" to account for different ambient conditions. For example, in the winter the thermostat might be barely cracked open, and in the middle of the summer it might be open quite a bit. But the whole point is that the thermostat is supposed to regulate the engine's temp by throttling the coolant flow through the radiator--the same way the thermostat in your house turns the AC on and off as needed.
If your thermostat is open all the way and the engine is hotter than the specified temp, that is a sign that the cooling system is not working properly for some reason. For example: poor water flow, a clogged radiator, too small of a radiator, no air flow through the radiator, etc. Another possibility is that the ambient conditions are too extreme (for example, you're in the middle of the desert at 110 degrees--though, this is technically a case of "too small radiator")
So yes, if everything is working as it should, you could put in a 160 degree thermostat, set your fans at a similar temp, and have your engine running at 160.
BUT you probably wouldn't want to do that. The efficiency of any heat-cycle engine is directly related to it's operating temperature. A hotter engine is more efficicent and burns cleaner. Also, oil becomes thicker at lower temps. Your oil pumping losses and friction go up as well. A "cold engine" is good for raw power (drag strip, for example), but it is poor for mileage. And in all cases you don't want to "beat on" your engine until it's up to temp and the oil is flowing.
10-12-2006, 03:06 AM
#13
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RE: What should I do to make it run Cooler ?
ORIGINAL: rex7010
NNNOOOOO DON'T DO THAT....!!!!! you will burn the motor up in your fan.. and I would bet that motor costs a few $$$$$
Rex
ORIGINAL: fordfanboy
Another quick suggestion is to reprogram your tune to make your fan run all the time while driving.
Another quick suggestion is to reprogram your tune to make your fan run all the time while driving.
NNNOOOOO DON'T DO THAT....!!!!! you will burn the motor up in your fan.. and I would bet that motor costs a few $$$$$
Rex
10-12-2006, 06:34 AM
#14
3rd Gear Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2005
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Posts: 864
RE: What should I do to make it run Cooler ?
here is the weather temp, since its october in which the weather gets cooler its now at an average of 35 degree celcius, but lets say may,june,july and augest.... it reaches something to 48 or 45 D.celcius in the after noon... and in the winter it reaches something like 23D.C in the after noon and at night something close to 19 16 ? RARELY goes to 10D.C
so if its what i understood the 160 is a good thermostat for me, because even if the OEM thermostat was 195 180 wont make a good diffrence,
another thing is that, I have my number plates which I think blocks the radiator ? here is a pic..
so if its what i understood the 160 is a good thermostat for me, because even if the OEM thermostat was 195 180 wont make a good diffrence,
another thing is that, I have my number plates which I think blocks the radiator ? here is a pic..
10-12-2006, 01:10 PM
#17
2nd Gear Member
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Maryland
Posts: 355
RE: What should I do to make it run Cooler ?
Does the temp guage show that you are overheating or even running hot?
You have talked about wanting to run cooler, but what makes you think the ENGINE is running too hot now?
I don't think your shifting issue is related to the engine temp.
You have talked about wanting to run cooler, but what makes you think the ENGINE is running too hot now?
I don't think your shifting issue is related to the engine temp.
10-12-2006, 07:58 PM
#18
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RE: What should I do to make it run Cooler ?
ORIGINAL: saud alzaabi
its a manual,
and why not use lower than 180 ? btw im living in the middle east .... and it really gets hot here...
its a manual,
and why not use lower than 180 ? btw im living in the middle east .... and it really gets hot here...
Your license plate is not blocking your radiator flow. It is fine.
As for the 160 degree thermostat, you don't want to run that in a daily driver car because it will not allow your engine to reach it's designed operating tempature in an optimal amount of time and it will cause PCM error codes.
Also, I echo what everyone is asking. How are you determining that you are overheating? Do you have aftermarket gauges that show you the tempature? Are you data logging? Or are you simply relying on the factory analog idiot light?
10-12-2006, 08:20 PM
#19
I ♥ Acer
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Texas
Posts: 3,225
RE: What should I do to make it run Cooler ?
ORIGINAL: CrazyAl
Anyway, the whole point of the thermostat is to regulate the engine temperature. A "low temp" thermostat makes the engine run cooler becasue it opens up at a lower temperature, allowing the radiator to be utilized sooner and more often.
Think of it this way: The thermostat is like "the boss" that attempts to set the engine's temp. When the engine is too cold (at startup, for example) the thermostat is closed. This prevents coolant from circulating into the radiator. The coolant stays inside the engine and the whole assembly warms up quickly. As the engine hits the specified temp, the thermostat begins to open. The hotter it gets, the more it opens up. If the engine is "too hot" the thermostat is open all the way, allowing the radiator to get rid of the extra heat. As the engine cools down, the thermostat begins to close, decreasing radiator flow, and ideally settling at a happy medium. During ideal operating conditions, the thermostat will be partially open and the engine will be at (or very close to) the specified temp. The thermostat has varying degrees of "open and closed" to account for different ambient conditions. For example, in the winter the thermostat might be barely cracked open, and in the middle of the summer it might be open quite a bit. But the whole point is that the thermostat is supposed to regulate the engine's temp by throttling the coolant flow through the radiator--the same way the thermostat in your house turns the AC on and off as needed.
If your thermostat is open all the way and the engine is hotter than the specified temp, that is a sign that the cooling system is not working properly for some reason. For example: poor water flow, a clogged radiator, too small of a radiator, no air flow through the radiator, etc. Another possibility is that the ambient conditions are too extreme (for example, you're in the middle of the desert at 110 degrees--though, this is technically a case of "too small radiator")
So yes, if everything is working as it should, you could put in a 160 degree thermostat, set your fans at a similar temp, and have your engine running at 160.
BUT you probably wouldn't want to do that. The efficiency of any heat-cycle engine is directly related to it's operating temperature. A hotter engine is more efficicent and burns cleaner. Also, oil becomes thicker at lower temps. Your oil pumping losses and friction go up as well. A "cold engine" is good for raw power (drag strip, for example), but it is poor for mileage. And in all cases you don't want to "beat on" your engine until it's up to temp and the oil is flowing.
Anyway, the whole point of the thermostat is to regulate the engine temperature. A "low temp" thermostat makes the engine run cooler becasue it opens up at a lower temperature, allowing the radiator to be utilized sooner and more often.
Think of it this way: The thermostat is like "the boss" that attempts to set the engine's temp. When the engine is too cold (at startup, for example) the thermostat is closed. This prevents coolant from circulating into the radiator. The coolant stays inside the engine and the whole assembly warms up quickly. As the engine hits the specified temp, the thermostat begins to open. The hotter it gets, the more it opens up. If the engine is "too hot" the thermostat is open all the way, allowing the radiator to get rid of the extra heat. As the engine cools down, the thermostat begins to close, decreasing radiator flow, and ideally settling at a happy medium. During ideal operating conditions, the thermostat will be partially open and the engine will be at (or very close to) the specified temp. The thermostat has varying degrees of "open and closed" to account for different ambient conditions. For example, in the winter the thermostat might be barely cracked open, and in the middle of the summer it might be open quite a bit. But the whole point is that the thermostat is supposed to regulate the engine's temp by throttling the coolant flow through the radiator--the same way the thermostat in your house turns the AC on and off as needed.
If your thermostat is open all the way and the engine is hotter than the specified temp, that is a sign that the cooling system is not working properly for some reason. For example: poor water flow, a clogged radiator, too small of a radiator, no air flow through the radiator, etc. Another possibility is that the ambient conditions are too extreme (for example, you're in the middle of the desert at 110 degrees--though, this is technically a case of "too small radiator")
So yes, if everything is working as it should, you could put in a 160 degree thermostat, set your fans at a similar temp, and have your engine running at 160.
BUT you probably wouldn't want to do that. The efficiency of any heat-cycle engine is directly related to it's operating temperature. A hotter engine is more efficicent and burns cleaner. Also, oil becomes thicker at lower temps. Your oil pumping losses and friction go up as well. A "cold engine" is good for raw power (drag strip, for example), but it is poor for mileage. And in all cases you don't want to "beat on" your engine until it's up to temp and the oil is flowing.
A thermostat is going to stay closed until it reaches a certain tempature. Yes. That I agree with. It is going to open at that tempature and allow flow. I agree with that. It is going to fully open and allow complete flow at a different tempature. I will buy that too. But after that is where I start to disagree. The tempature of the thermostat regulates how quickly your car is going to reach operating tempature, not what tempature your car runs. If you have a higher temp thermostat, your car is going to reach operating tempature quicker because it will restrict coolant circulation to the engine for a longer period of time. But once it opens and allows circulation your engine is still going to go up to whatever it's operating tempature for the conditions it is operating in. Not just go up to the tempature setting of your thermostat and stop.
10-12-2006, 11:00 PM
#20
5th Gear Member
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location:
Posts: 2,544
RE: What should I do to make it run Cooler ?
Hey Hawg,
Let me try to explain this in a different way.
The whole cooling system can be thought of as a "box of heat". The engine is constantly putting heat into the box. At the same time, the radiator is dumping heat out of the engine.
The engine is "adding heat" at a fairly constant rate. Of course it will vary with RPM, but even then there's a limit. If you're driving at some certain RPM, the heat is going into the "box" at a certain fixed rate.
The radiator (assuming unrestricted flow) is going to be dumping out heat at some constant rate also. However, this rate is dependant on ambient temperature.
The thermostat's job is to throttle the coolant flow in an attempt to match these two rates. In other words, it's closed when the engine first starts. It stays closed as the engine warms up. Once the engine is up to temp, it attempts to regulate flow such that the radiator is draining out heat at the same rate that the engine is adding heat, thereby maintaining a constant temperature. The whole job of the thermostat is to maintain the engine at a set temperature. (This is the dictionary defination of a thermostat, see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thermostat)
Of course, certain extreme conditions can exist whereby the thermostat, even when open 100%, cannot keep the engine cooled down as much as it should. When an automaker designs a car they spec out the water flow, size of the radiator, etc, in order to make the system meet most needs. However, if ever the heat rejecting capacity of the radiator is smaller than the rate at which heat is generated by the engine, then the temperature will creep up. It's the same situtation that might happen if your A/C can't keep your house at 60 degrees on a very hot day. The A/C runs all the time but the temp is still above what you want it.
To use your example: If it's 105 degrees ambient and you have a 180 thermostat but an engine temp of 210 then then the situation I just described applies to you. Your radiator is "too small" for your engine's heat output.
I'd bet good money that on your car, your engine would be operating at 180 (or very close) up through 80 degrees or so ambient temp. At that point your radiator isn't good enough and the temp will start creeping upwards more and more. But whenever you're in cooler temps it will be at 180 spot on (or so close it doesn't matter)
By the way, I have no personal experience with the FRPP radiator for these cars, I do remember reading earlier posts on this forum whereby it was described as being insignificantly better than stock. A solution might be an aftermarket radiator like a Fluidyne.
If I remember right you're pushing some serious HP (blower? turbo?). It's not unreasonable for the FRPP radiator to be too small for your needs.
Let me try to explain this in a different way.
The whole cooling system can be thought of as a "box of heat". The engine is constantly putting heat into the box. At the same time, the radiator is dumping heat out of the engine.
The engine is "adding heat" at a fairly constant rate. Of course it will vary with RPM, but even then there's a limit. If you're driving at some certain RPM, the heat is going into the "box" at a certain fixed rate.
The radiator (assuming unrestricted flow) is going to be dumping out heat at some constant rate also. However, this rate is dependant on ambient temperature.
The thermostat's job is to throttle the coolant flow in an attempt to match these two rates. In other words, it's closed when the engine first starts. It stays closed as the engine warms up. Once the engine is up to temp, it attempts to regulate flow such that the radiator is draining out heat at the same rate that the engine is adding heat, thereby maintaining a constant temperature. The whole job of the thermostat is to maintain the engine at a set temperature. (This is the dictionary defination of a thermostat, see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thermostat)
Of course, certain extreme conditions can exist whereby the thermostat, even when open 100%, cannot keep the engine cooled down as much as it should. When an automaker designs a car they spec out the water flow, size of the radiator, etc, in order to make the system meet most needs. However, if ever the heat rejecting capacity of the radiator is smaller than the rate at which heat is generated by the engine, then the temperature will creep up. It's the same situtation that might happen if your A/C can't keep your house at 60 degrees on a very hot day. The A/C runs all the time but the temp is still above what you want it.
To use your example: If it's 105 degrees ambient and you have a 180 thermostat but an engine temp of 210 then then the situation I just described applies to you. Your radiator is "too small" for your engine's heat output.
I'd bet good money that on your car, your engine would be operating at 180 (or very close) up through 80 degrees or so ambient temp. At that point your radiator isn't good enough and the temp will start creeping upwards more and more. But whenever you're in cooler temps it will be at 180 spot on (or so close it doesn't matter)
By the way, I have no personal experience with the FRPP radiator for these cars, I do remember reading earlier posts on this forum whereby it was described as being insignificantly better than stock. A solution might be an aftermarket radiator like a Fluidyne.
If I remember right you're pushing some serious HP (blower? turbo?). It's not unreasonable for the FRPP radiator to be too small for your needs.