BMR relocation bracket setting??
03-22-2008, 11:43 PM
#21
5th Gear Member
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Redding, CA
Posts: 4,552
RE: BMR relocation bracket setting??
Thats what I thought it was. To get mine as square as possible I picked a pointon the front wheel and measured to a point on the rear wheel. Then I got the both sides set to the same length, I looked at it, itlooked okay. So I drove it and I'm happy.
I probably screwed it up but, oh well.
I probably screwed it up but, oh well.
03-23-2008, 08:12 AM
#22
6th Gear Member
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: state of confusion
Posts: 7,635
RE: BMR relocation bracket setting??
Get somebody with a really sharp eye who knows what to look for to follow you and see if the car is "dog-tracking" at all. If it's not immediately obvious, have whoever try weaving back and forth in the lane. It might be possible to tell by differences in when the front tire becomes visible "outside" of the rear tire, right vs left, relative to how much of the side of the car is visible or some other reference.
Best if you can find a pair of control holes in the chassis to measure from. If the steering is at all turned when you reference off the front wheels, the wheelbases will not be equal with a rear axle that's perfectly square in the chassis. Even caster that differs from side to side (IOW, non-zero "cross caster") can introduce error.
Norm
Best if you can find a pair of control holes in the chassis to measure from. If the steering is at all turned when you reference off the front wheels, the wheelbases will not be equal with a rear axle that's perfectly square in the chassis. Even caster that differs from side to side (IOW, non-zero "cross caster") can introduce error.
Norm
04-16-2008, 09:53 PM
#23
2nd Gear Member
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location:
Posts: 151
RE: BMR relocation bracket setting??
UPDATE: Did not go with the Steeda brackets. I ended up moving the LCA's up one hole on the BMR brackets and with a full tank of gas and my big *** in the drivers seat the arms were damn near level. Just a tick down, but not much. Moving the arms up to the stock postition they pointed UP!! The first position in the BMR's are much closer to level. Track day is this Saturday and I hope to feel a positive change in the handling. Admitingly I have changed PHB from Steeda(urethane) to UMI (rod ends) and hope also to "feel" a positive effect. Hard to track down an improvement when you change multiple things..
04-28-2008, 04:33 PM
#24
4th Gear Member
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: California
Posts: 1,471
RE: BMR relocation bracket setting??
ORIGINAL: Kobie
UPDATE: Did not go with the Steeda brackets. I ended up moving the LCA's up one hole on the BMR brackets and with a full tank of gas and my big *** in the drivers seat the arms were damn near level. Just a tick down, but not much. Moving the arms up to the stock postition they pointed UP!! The first position in the BMR's are much closer to level. Track day is this Saturday and I hope to feel a positive change in the handling. Admitingly I have changed PHB from Steeda(urethane) to UMI (rod ends) and hope also to "feel" a positive effect. Hard to track down an improvement when you change multiple things..
UPDATE: Did not go with the Steeda brackets. I ended up moving the LCA's up one hole on the BMR brackets and with a full tank of gas and my big *** in the drivers seat the arms were damn near level. Just a tick down, but not much. Moving the arms up to the stock postition they pointed UP!! The first position in the BMR's are much closer to level. Track day is this Saturday and I hope to feel a positive change in the handling. Admitingly I have changed PHB from Steeda(urethane) to UMI (rod ends) and hope also to "feel" a positive effect. Hard to track down an improvement when you change multiple things..
Why did you change the plan? I guess now youknow whySteeda LCA relocation brackets are better with their additional two adjustment holes right where you need them.
HTH!
04-29-2008, 08:12 PM
#25
5th Gear Member
Join Date: May 2005
Location: S.burbs Chicago
Posts: 4,793
RE: BMR relocation bracket setting??
I guess Ill update myself also, lol.
I changed plans too and did not go with the BMR's, and just went with the CHE brackets.
Installed today, along with the CHE UCA. Took about exaclty on hour for install time, quicker that I had thought! Bonus!
CHE only has one hole, and it put my CHE adj LCA's about dead level. to the ground.
I changed plans too and did not go with the BMR's, and just went with the CHE brackets.
Installed today, along with the CHE UCA. Took about exaclty on hour for install time, quicker that I had thought! Bonus!
CHE only has one hole, and it put my CHE adj LCA's about dead level. to the ground.
05-01-2008, 11:40 AM
#26
2nd Gear Member
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location:
Posts: 151
RE: BMR relocation bracket setting??
F1,
Well a few reasons.
1. Time ran out before my trackday so figured I'd try moving them up a notch. I found that with the Gt500 arms ( stock ones for that matter ) I could not use the upper hole because the end of the arm is too large and it hit the brackets upper bolt sleeve. I worked around this by removing the sleeve and relocating it above the bolt. It just sits above the bolt and is clamped in position when the upper bolt crushes the bracket. The end result was VERY close to being level.
2. The Steeda brackets would require ( I think ) the use of arms with a smaller end on them. I have been advised by many including yourself that the GTA500 arms are more than adequate for roadracing/autocross use that I do. I'm not apposed to new arms it's just that I don't want to change parts unless they improve handling.
3. From reading several posts and the installation instructions for the Steeda brackets I'm not sure there is someone locally I can trust to install them correctly.
The arms are close to level with my current setup. How critical is it that they be perfectly level and will the change of parts to achieve this be worth it in the long run??
Well a few reasons.
1. Time ran out before my trackday so figured I'd try moving them up a notch. I found that with the Gt500 arms ( stock ones for that matter ) I could not use the upper hole because the end of the arm is too large and it hit the brackets upper bolt sleeve. I worked around this by removing the sleeve and relocating it above the bolt. It just sits above the bolt and is clamped in position when the upper bolt crushes the bracket. The end result was VERY close to being level.
2. The Steeda brackets would require ( I think ) the use of arms with a smaller end on them. I have been advised by many including yourself that the GTA500 arms are more than adequate for roadracing/autocross use that I do. I'm not apposed to new arms it's just that I don't want to change parts unless they improve handling.
3. From reading several posts and the installation instructions for the Steeda brackets I'm not sure there is someone locally I can trust to install them correctly.
The arms are close to level with my current setup. How critical is it that they be perfectly level and will the change of parts to achieve this be worth it in the long run??
05-01-2008, 12:01 PM
#27
6th Gear Member
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: state of confusion
Posts: 7,635
RE: BMR relocation bracket setting??
At this point, all I can say is that perfectly level is only approximately correct (and that perhaps should be measured with the driver seated). The ideal inclination might vary slightly either way from there depending on the exact LCA pivot point coordinates as far as axle roll steer is concerned, but I haven't gotten around to doing that and haven't seen any of that data published anywhere.
Norm
Norm
05-01-2008, 05:43 PM
#28
4th Gear Member
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: California
Posts: 1,471
RE: BMR relocation bracket setting??
ORIGINAL: Kobie
F1,
Well a few reasons.
1. Time ran out before my trackday so figured I'd try moving them up a notch. I found that with the Gt500 arms ( stock ones for that matter ) I could not use the upper hole because the end of the arm is too large and it hit the brackets upper bolt sleeve. I worked around this by removing the sleeve and relocating it above the bolt. It just sits above the bolt and is clamped in position when the upper bolt crushes the bracket. The end result was VERY close to being level.
2. The Steeda brackets would require ( I think ) the use of arms with a smaller end on them. I have been advised by many including yourself that the GTA500 arms are more than adequate for roadracing/autocross use that I do. I'm not apposed to new arms it's just that I don't want to change parts unless they improve handling.
3. From reading several posts and the installation instructions for the Steeda brackets I'm not sure there is someone locally I can trust to install them correctly.
The arms are close to level with my current setup. How critical is it that they be perfectly level and will the change of parts to achieve this be worth it in the long run??
F1,
Well a few reasons.
1. Time ran out before my trackday so figured I'd try moving them up a notch. I found that with the Gt500 arms ( stock ones for that matter ) I could not use the upper hole because the end of the arm is too large and it hit the brackets upper bolt sleeve. I worked around this by removing the sleeve and relocating it above the bolt. It just sits above the bolt and is clamped in position when the upper bolt crushes the bracket. The end result was VERY close to being level.
2. The Steeda brackets would require ( I think ) the use of arms with a smaller end on them. I have been advised by many including yourself that the GTA500 arms are more than adequate for roadracing/autocross use that I do. I'm not apposed to new arms it's just that I don't want to change parts unless they improve handling.
3. From reading several posts and the installation instructions for the Steeda brackets I'm not sure there is someone locally I can trust to install them correctly.
The arms are close to level with my current setup. How critical is it that they be perfectly level and will the change of parts to achieve this be worth it in the long run??
1. The Steeda LCA relocationbrackets are weld-in and thereshould not be anyclearance problem.
2.Any of the LCA's should fit as long as they fitinside the stock LCA's sideviewoutline.
3. This I can easily understand how you feel.
Hey refresh my memorywhat LCA brackets are you using BMR bolt-in's? Which sportsprings are you running that has the rear ride heightlow enough that the LCA's are level? Your car must be really low in back. My car with a full tank of gaswith the bottom damper bolts loose stting on Steeda coilovers with the 200lb. springs in back and the ride height adjusted as far down as they can go has thestock full lengthaxle bumpstops sittingjustbarelytouchingthe framerails. This isWAY too low (as the cartends to bottom out in backover even smallbumps at 65-90mph)and even with the Steeda street adjustable LCA's in the top hole ofBMR weld-in LCA brackets the LCA's are almost closelevel but still point down hill to the axleslightly. I'm about to raise the rear ride height 1/2" and move the LCA's back up to the stock position or maybe drill a new hole in the middle of the BMR LCA brackets. GRRR!
Cheers!
05-01-2008, 06:25 PM
#29
2nd Gear Member
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location:
Posts: 151
RE: BMR relocation bracket setting??
F1,
I have the BMR brackets. I welded them in and left the bolts in just in case. Makes sense that they will fit without that bolt in there. I have the Steeda Sport springs. The car looks like it sits the same as the factory Steeda cars do. I measured with a full tank of gas. To check the level I used a 2' level touching both ends of the control arm. I guess a better way to measure might be from each bolt center to the ground???
I have the BMR brackets. I welded them in and left the bolts in just in case. Makes sense that they will fit without that bolt in there. I have the Steeda Sport springs. The car looks like it sits the same as the factory Steeda cars do. I measured with a full tank of gas. To check the level I used a 2' level touching both ends of the control arm. I guess a better way to measure might be from each bolt center to the ground???
05-01-2008, 07:28 PM
#30
4th Gear Member
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: California
Posts: 1,471
RE: BMR relocation bracket setting??
ORIGINAL: Kobie
F1,
I have the BMR brackets. I welded them in and left the bolts in just in case. Makes sense that they will fit without that bolt in there. I have the Steeda Sport springs. The car looks like it sits the same as the factory Steeda cars do. I measured with a full tank of gas. To check the level I used a 2' level touching both ends of the control arm. I guess a better way to measure might be from each bolt center to the ground???
F1,
I have the BMR brackets. I welded them in and left the bolts in just in case. Makes sense that they will fit without that bolt in there. I have the Steeda Sport springs. The car looks like it sits the same as the factory Steeda cars do. I measured with a full tank of gas. To check the level I used a 2' level touching both ends of the control arm. I guess a better way to measure might be from each bolt center to the ground???
Yoursecond measurement methodis much better as the ground levelunder the car is hard to measure well. I found that in order to get the car to handle well at high speed I like the LCA's pointing level to a couple of degrees pointing up at the axle. At lower speeds in the canyons level or a couple of degrees down to the axle seems O.K. as this seems to help the rear end rotate faster. But this is not as stable at high to very high speeds and if you are cornering at higher speeds the car can be too fast at turn in if you have a larger (22mm+)rear anti-roll bar installed. Some of this can be tuned out or at least improvedby cranking up the rear dampers to help settle the carduring the inital turn-inbut then the ride suffers as doesbumpy road traction. So I like the LCA's to bedead level or a bit up hill. Oh, I'm not certain if this make a lot of difference but this is with a Steeda Comp UCA/UCA mount adjusted to the long setting and rearward IC setting.
HTH!