Full Saleen Suspension Kit
05-27-2009, 09:48 PM
#21
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location:
Posts: 10
Thanks for the input, looks like it will be one of those two. I did send an email to Sam and am waiting to talk with him.
What type of bushings do the FRPP kit use? Have tried to find that info, but have come up empty. From what I have read the bushings can make a huge difference in the feel and noise from the set up.
Does the FRPP kit lower more than the Roush?
Smokievol
What type of bushings do the FRPP kit use? Have tried to find that info, but have come up empty. From what I have read the bushings can make a huge difference in the feel and noise from the set up.
Does the FRPP kit lower more than the Roush?
Smokievol
05-28-2009, 07:15 PM
#23
Former Sponsor
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,936
I take painstaking effort to make sure that almost everything I post is surgically accurate. You have to have that behavior when you work for and around high end racing teams. I just submitted an application for an apprenticeship with an Indy Racing League team FYI buddy. You seem to think I like Saleen when I haven't even ran their stuff for a VERY long time. That, combined with the fact that it looks like you have a problem with a large number of my posts and whats in them says that you're an idiot, both consistently and substantially. The reason I spin or go off in cars so often is because I push cars on a track HARD, I'm the most aggressive driver I know. You realize that autocross is parking lot racing at low speed? They go to an empty football stadium and set up cones. My good friend Jim Downing told me that it's the only motorsport that wouldn't need his invention, because it's a joke.
I don't think that way of autocross exactly but I'd put more faith in organizations like Steeda's American Iron racing team which let me drive their Steeda QS6 prototype at Homestead last year and took my input on their car happily.
Thanks a lot though.
I don't think that way of autocross exactly but I'd put more faith in organizations like Steeda's American Iron racing team which let me drive their Steeda QS6 prototype at Homestead last year and took my input on their car happily.
Thanks a lot though.
So to sum it all up:
You applied for a job as an apprentice and you are now an expert. You think that I don't know anything because I'm just a lowly autocrosser. That's typical.
I'll let the video's and the detail in my previous posts speak for themselves and let the others decide. I'll also add that lowly autocrossers make kick-*** road-racers. Folks I've instructed and beaten for Championships have done such things as put their car on Pole as a rookie at the Runoffs. Won World Challenge races (more than one guy in fact). Were rookie of the year in World Challenge. Won championships too. And I'm proud to even call some of them my friends. And fwiw, I happen to know the Technical Director of an ALMS team, he and the team he works for won the 24 of LeMans last year (that'd be this car: http://www.risicompetizione.com)..... Ironically we happen to see setup in a very similar manner where aero is not involved. And FWIW, he also has worked for Brumos Porsche, a few other Grand-Am teams, and even for the short lived Maserait MC12 ALMS effort (and his stories about Michelotti are great). That'd be this car:
http://www.fiagt.com/gallerypic.php?...n=2009&event=2
No, I don't road race... I'm not rich and can't afford to walk away from a written off car should that happen (and can due to somone else's dumb mistake). I also don't have the time, and frankly I like autocrossing--it's pure handling and driving. No aero downforce, you don't get outspent by the loaded folks, and it's a mentally tough game to put the car on the limit, right away, on courses you can't practice on for years, or even a day. You walk it, you drive it.
Last edited by Sam Strano; 05-29-2009 at 01:10 PM.
05-29-2009, 08:10 AM
#25
6th Gear Member
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: state of confusion
Posts: 7,635
I wonder if perhaps some of the Modified Category drivers are wearing HANS or similar equipment already.
Norm
05-29-2009, 01:17 PM
#26
Former Sponsor
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,936
So because there is little to hit, it's not relevant? Wow, you are showing just how clueless you are Legion5.
FWIW, if you asked Mr. Downing and Mr. Hubbard I'm sure they will tell you that neck injuries can and do happen at road speeds, included in which is autocross. You seem to think that speed = knowledge and that's not right. I don't know Jim Downing except for seeing interviews and such when he was running Camel Lights. He never struck me like an ***, and I can't imagine he'd snub folks like that. And if he did, I'd have to simply counter that I guess Camel Lights cars aren't real race cars because they were not nearly as quick as GTP cars.....
Since Legion5, like many others, seem to think it's so easy to do I'd invite him to come to a National event and prove it. I'd not even object to him running his much, much more modified car against the F-stock car I run. If he's got the nuts to be embarrassed I'd be glad to do it for him. Again, a lot of huffing and puffing, but not much tangible information. At least I can produce a video showing what a very basic suspension is capable of. And before he seemed to think 1.18 is a lot of grip (and it is for a street car if it truly makes that on a level surface). But now despite the fact I can pull higher numbers he seems to dismiss that because I'm a lowly autocrosser... Sad. And sorry, but I still don't buy his car can do that on non-r comp tires. A Viper SRT-10 and 997 GT3 can't even on Michelin Pilot Sport Cup DOT approved R-comps steady-state.
FWIW, if you asked Mr. Downing and Mr. Hubbard I'm sure they will tell you that neck injuries can and do happen at road speeds, included in which is autocross. You seem to think that speed = knowledge and that's not right. I don't know Jim Downing except for seeing interviews and such when he was running Camel Lights. He never struck me like an ***, and I can't imagine he'd snub folks like that. And if he did, I'd have to simply counter that I guess Camel Lights cars aren't real race cars because they were not nearly as quick as GTP cars.....
Since Legion5, like many others, seem to think it's so easy to do I'd invite him to come to a National event and prove it. I'd not even object to him running his much, much more modified car against the F-stock car I run. If he's got the nuts to be embarrassed I'd be glad to do it for him. Again, a lot of huffing and puffing, but not much tangible information. At least I can produce a video showing what a very basic suspension is capable of. And before he seemed to think 1.18 is a lot of grip (and it is for a street car if it truly makes that on a level surface). But now despite the fact I can pull higher numbers he seems to dismiss that because I'm a lowly autocrosser... Sad. And sorry, but I still don't buy his car can do that on non-r comp tires. A Viper SRT-10 and 997 GT3 can't even on Michelin Pilot Sport Cup DOT approved R-comps steady-state.
05-29-2009, 01:27 PM
#28
Former Sponsor
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,936
I wonder is ski jumpers think slalom skiing is a joke since they just run around gates for time? There are snobs everywhere, I think we found the one on this site.
I also wanted to add this to Legion5. I'm sure he'll not stand up and run an autox against me (or most anyone else). He'll probably say it's beneath him. If so I'll remind him that he has no reason not to. It's easy to find on, accessable, and requires nothing special. Good old fashioned, pure to the point grudge match running two cars as fast as you can drive them/they'll let you go, in a controlled, safe place, that shows the mechanical grip and transitional stability of a car.
All testing of major magazines incoporate autox type things in their procedures. Slalom? Skidpad? And AMCI is company that does a lot of official testing for car companies. All their test drivers are autocrossers, and one in particular was featured right alongside Steve Millen in an article last year in Road&Track comparing various cars. They ran them on the Superspeedway @ California, on a road course (I seem to recall it being Willow Springs), and @ El Toro AFB for the ProSolo (autox) portion. The autox part of the article was as in depth and counted to the results as much as the road course and the speedway portions.
I also wanted to add this to Legion5. I'm sure he'll not stand up and run an autox against me (or most anyone else). He'll probably say it's beneath him. If so I'll remind him that he has no reason not to. It's easy to find on, accessable, and requires nothing special. Good old fashioned, pure to the point grudge match running two cars as fast as you can drive them/they'll let you go, in a controlled, safe place, that shows the mechanical grip and transitional stability of a car.
All testing of major magazines incoporate autox type things in their procedures. Slalom? Skidpad? And AMCI is company that does a lot of official testing for car companies. All their test drivers are autocrossers, and one in particular was featured right alongside Steve Millen in an article last year in Road&Track comparing various cars. They ran them on the Superspeedway @ California, on a road course (I seem to recall it being Willow Springs), and @ El Toro AFB for the ProSolo (autox) portion. The autox part of the article was as in depth and counted to the results as much as the road course and the speedway portions.
05-29-2009, 02:49 PM
#29
5th Gear Member
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Near Wash. DC Posts: 13,541
Posts: 2,497
Actually that post was directed at some one who said I always like Saleen's parts in all my posts like an idiot fanboy when that's not true (my Saleen is Roushcharged for one because Roush has a more low end power for the same output and is less restrictive at high output, and I don't run any Saleen suspension now).
Anyway your name was dropped saying that they would put more faith in you based souly on your autocross racing victories they were aware of in your signature when my job in the racing world is analyzing and tweaking telemetry results in pro and pro scca road course racing.
Now I don't disrepsect autocross I was just defending myself, in fact the main reason I like it is because you don't have to run a team that's painted green to do it like you mentioned.
I hope this doesn't sound patronizing but I like the fact that two of your friends serve high end roles in road racing that's good.
FYI racing isn't as dangerous as you make it out to be though Sam Strano I haven't totaled anything since the past 5 years. Tracks are built in a surprisingly safe way compared to what's depicted in the big crashes hyped by the media which mostly happens in high pressure high contact driving. when you are turning there's lots of room to reasonably slow down outside of the turn and there is little catastrophic contact between average drivers in lower level road racing.
Anyway your name was dropped saying that they would put more faith in you based souly on your autocross racing victories they were aware of in your signature when my job in the racing world is analyzing and tweaking telemetry results in pro and pro scca road course racing.
Now I don't disrepsect autocross I was just defending myself, in fact the main reason I like it is because you don't have to run a team that's painted green to do it like you mentioned.
I hope this doesn't sound patronizing but I like the fact that two of your friends serve high end roles in road racing that's good.
FYI racing isn't as dangerous as you make it out to be though Sam Strano I haven't totaled anything since the past 5 years. Tracks are built in a surprisingly safe way compared to what's depicted in the big crashes hyped by the media which mostly happens in high pressure high contact driving. when you are turning there's lots of room to reasonably slow down outside of the turn and there is little catastrophic contact between average drivers in lower level road racing.
Last edited by Legion5; 05-31-2009 at 02:35 AM.
05-29-2009, 05:08 PM
#30
4th Gear Member
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: CA
Posts: 1,700
If you have 100 hours to adjust them and professional help such as available through myself or others if willing... then yes.
99.999999999999999999999999999999999999999
999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
99999999999999999% of adjustable suspensions on the street perform worse than stock and usually do the following, they stiffen up the car to make it annoying to drive in, they improve it's skid pad rating, they make the car feel like it handles better and they make the car impossible to drive at the limit to the point of being a joke all while making it less safe to drive on the street. I've personally tested all the modified suspension mustangs in the local club in my area at one point, and the ones with adjustable dampers were horrific to drive in many many ways. One of them couldn't even take a slalom with the traction control off or it would completely skid out and it was one of the faster ones as measured by that test. It was slightly better than stock. The worst handling cars on the planet have to be the ones with adjustable suspension tuned at people's kitchen tables.
Adjustable suspension is mostly for people who are afraid of driving a car which might come setup too harsh from a tuner who knows what they are doing, and I can tell you the Saleen setup is not like that. You also take the Saleen with a adjustable suspension car that has the same components and put the cash savings you gained from the package into better tires on the Saleen and when you face them off in handling the Saleen it will beat the adjustable car. Guaranteed and without any possibility of a differing outcome with both cars.
The statistics are so stacked against adjustable suspension in my experience from track driving porsches, audis SRT-4s, classic cars, show cars, one of Toyota's own factory show cars setup by their own workers (body designers) and that's really a complete list, but all of them were horrible. The only good adjustable car setup for the street I've ever driven was an Elise set up by some one who owned a racing team lol.
Just something to think about. Now I'm sure all the cars with adjustable suspensions might have been slightly faster than a lumpy stock setup but they were terrible to drive and could only have the slimmest chance to compete with a properly tuned car of the same model like a Saleen or Steeda for the Mustang especially one with more mods which you might be able to afford in comparison to the price of an adjustable setup.
99.999999999999999999999999999999999999999
999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
99999999999999999% of adjustable suspensions on the street perform worse than stock and usually do the following, they stiffen up the car to make it annoying to drive in, they improve it's skid pad rating, they make the car feel like it handles better and they make the car impossible to drive at the limit to the point of being a joke all while making it less safe to drive on the street. I've personally tested all the modified suspension mustangs in the local club in my area at one point, and the ones with adjustable dampers were horrific to drive in many many ways. One of them couldn't even take a slalom with the traction control off or it would completely skid out and it was one of the faster ones as measured by that test. It was slightly better than stock. The worst handling cars on the planet have to be the ones with adjustable suspension tuned at people's kitchen tables.
Adjustable suspension is mostly for people who are afraid of driving a car which might come setup too harsh from a tuner who knows what they are doing, and I can tell you the Saleen setup is not like that. You also take the Saleen with a adjustable suspension car that has the same components and put the cash savings you gained from the package into better tires on the Saleen and when you face them off in handling the Saleen it will beat the adjustable car. Guaranteed and without any possibility of a differing outcome with both cars.
The statistics are so stacked against adjustable suspension in my experience from track driving porsches, audis SRT-4s, classic cars, show cars, one of Toyota's own factory show cars setup by their own workers (body designers) and that's really a complete list, but all of them were horrible. The only good adjustable car setup for the street I've ever driven was an Elise set up by some one who owned a racing team lol.
Just something to think about. Now I'm sure all the cars with adjustable suspensions might have been slightly faster than a lumpy stock setup but they were terrible to drive and could only have the slimmest chance to compete with a properly tuned car of the same model like a Saleen or Steeda for the Mustang especially one with more mods which you might be able to afford in comparison to the price of an adjustable setup.
This is the most assinine post I have ever seen. It proves more and more how little you ACTUALLY know. Posts like this from people like you are the problem with all of these forums.
Troll.