Ansibe

JAJ, if you're from BC you're probably going to Portland, right? A good friend of mine raced bikes there, and he said it was very fast. I'll bet it's a blast in the M. 3500 km there is mighty impressive.

Trailing throttle run-on in the GT is a bit strange. My <ahem> 2000 Focus did that pretty dramatically, but I never noticed it at the track (seriously, I took my stock focus to the track as often as I could afford to). Mind you, in a focus you're pretty much WFO everywhere! I wonder if it will be a problem in the GT... Is this a Ford emissions thing?

I definitely lack experience wrt to tires. I've run Kuhmos (grippy, but flexy), Avons (lacked grip, but very predictable), RE50s (not much grip, not much feedback), and re11s (terrible, despite the reviews. Maybe it was me). I'm looking forward to the PZeros.

JAJ

Most of my driving is at Mission Raceway just east of Vancouver. Mission is 2.2km with 9 very technical and rather bumpy turns. 320KM at Mission is a good day. It takes about 110 liters of fuel.

Our club plans a day at Portland every fall, but since 2008 they've had trouble getting enough sign-ups so it's been cancelled. I don't know why for sure, but it is a pretty big investment of time and money - 500km each way and at least one over-night if not two. The flip side is that Portland is such a great track. I did a couple of days down there with the local BMW club, and while the instructor taught me a lot, I just couldn't convince myself that two days and a 1000km round trip was worth it for 90 minutes of driving.

On the throttle thing, my understanding is that delaying the throttle closing is part of the emissions strategy, although if BMW and Porsche don't need to do it, what's up with Ford? "Engine braking" is one of the features of the Boss 302 Track Key, so Ford knows about it.

I'm sure your Focus was a blast - someone once said "it's more fun to drive a slow car fast than it is to drive a fast car slow".

So, you didn't like the RE11's eh? I'm not surprised. I had a set of RE01R's, the predecessor to the RE11, and they were good for about three outings, then they got so hard they had no grip at all, even with 50% tread left.

Argonaut

You guys have me curious about the stock throttle response on the 5.0 - whats the problem exactly?

On the 4.6 the stock response stinks - you press the gas pedal and its close to a second (not really but it feels like it) before the car responds. It makes doing a heel-toe downshift a pain. So the SOP is to get an aftermarket tune. My Brenspeed tune has instant response - both when I hit the gas and when I let off.

Ansibe

When you lift throttle on the '11 GT, it feels like the the gas is still on a little bit - you slow down, but not too much. Then half a second later you get full engine braking.

I like the throttle response of the '11 GT. It's a little soft initially, which is great for 2nd and 3rd gear power application at corner apex. I found the M3 too sharp, even in normal, for smooth power delivery. I'm actually afraid to get a "tune" in case it wrecks the throttle response. It's not like I need more power. Yet.

I've not had any heel/toe issues. I actually like the GT better than my last 3 cars (mini, mazdaspeed3, m3). I think that comfort on downshifts varies with the driver. I like close pedals, and a fairly high brake that is not too sensitive. Somehow the GT is about perfect for me.

JAJ

I agree with you on the power delivery side for the '11 GT - it's nicely progressive and controllable, which will help a lot on the mid-corner throttle transition. That said, I haven't had any opportunity to drive it more than a short way so far - I'm only at 200km and the car's more or less stored for now. I've signed up for a auto-x style DE day on Jan 30th, so if the weather's good, I'll get a chance to play a bit.

I think that the driving position and the pedals in the GT are better than the M3. Heel and toe is easy and natural, and while the seat doesn't have 4" bolsters, it just fits me better. When I get back in the M3 after driving the GT, I feel like I'm sitting way too high.

Ansibe

Sitting too high: reason #2 why I sold my m3. Mine was a sedan, and even with the seat at the lowest position, my helmet hit the sunroof. The coupe with a sunroof was a non-starter. The coupe with the carbon roof seemed ok. I guess the lesson here is don't get a sunroof on a track car. Oddly, my e60 530i seat kept me well clear off the roof, and the ceiling height is the same.

I also think the GT seat is a little too high. I might get a sparco torino for the lower seating position and better bolsters. I found a used set for $1000.

M3hunter

Then, How can you match or better beat the M3 in this track, driving the 5.0 '11 GT Brembo?

Argonaut

By being a better driver :-) The cars are equal enough that the better driver will win.

I drive a C5 Vette on the track. At Summit Point last spring I had a 5.0 on my tail and could not shake him, and I was trying hard. It was stock except for R-comp tires. Later in the season I was on track with a new M3. I was taking it somewhat easy and saw him creeping up on me as the laps went by. So I put the hammer down and left him. I'm not sure what tires he had on but to me the biggest difference was the driver wasn't as good.

Ansibe

I don't think any normal car "beats" an M3. At Mosport my M3 was just as quick as 911s, but a well driven S5 was a bit quicker. Most people would agree that the M3 is the better car so I should have been faster, but that's not what happened. A z06 was faster still, even though the driver was maybe a little less experienced than me, and not as confident in the corners - 500 hp is hard to match. A zr1 completely dusted me. So quick I didn't have time to see if it was driven well, just to get out of the way! A GT500 was a rocket down the back straight, but parked in the corners.

I don't think there's too much to separate a stock M3 and the GT. M3 suspension is better, but the GT engine makes up for it. Sort out the suspension and I think the GT has the edge. And it's way easier to add hp to a GT than the BMW.

So what do I want from my GT? I want to hang with 911s, M3s, and S5s, and enjoy myself doing it. If I can do that it a car costing half as much, I win.

Lil_Chef

Take a look at my suspension mods, with those and just the 4.6 i regularly pass 911's (and once even a 996 turbo!), and M3's. with your extra horsepower you would be quite a bit faster.