2005Redfire6

Ohh alright I thought people would know that just from researching the tuners...

Nuke

I don't believe you'll find that type of info in ANY of the tuner adds (at least I never noticed that). But that info is something that I and others have experienced when experimenting with our tunes when we first received them and then we pass that info on.

I always suggest that people take their STOCK Stangs out for a hard series of runs immediately before they install their CAI & tune, then install the CAI and load the 87 custom tune, then repeat those hard runs, then reload the next higher tune and repeat the run, yada-yada. Unless you revert back to stock for some reason, you won't experience the 87 stock vs 87 custom tune difference.

Whitehorse10

At the end of the day your car is still a machine, not a computer. It makes power because of it's combination of heads, cams, exhaust, intake and crank case internals. I personally don't subscribe to the magic horsepower in a handheld box theory. Yes you can tweak the settings a little, but only a little (like + or - 10%). Even SCT on their website claims you will only get a maximum of 11 hp and 20 foot pounds of torque with their tuners and we all know how those advertiser claims can be; likely you're getting less. Thats not a lot horsepower for a 400 dollar tuner, at least in my opinion.

Does anyone ever stop to consider that just maybe Ford has put a pretty good tune on these cars from the factory? Why is the default assumption always that the factory tune sucks? A 2010 4.0 V6 Mustang is as fast as the famous 1978 Bandit edition 6.6 liter Pontiac Trans Am. That's a car with two more cylinders, 2.6 more liters of displacement and hell of a lot more fame. I think we're doing alright with the stock tune and stock mechanical configuration. If there was some way to get a vast improvement on an 87 octane tune, why wouldn't Ford go ahead and implement it into their PCM? Ever wonder that? Has anyone ever considered that maybe what you are feeling after a tune is just the change in the throttle response? I'm just asking.

You want to make real change in your car's horsepower? Try an X-Charger, or some deeper breathing heads, or a turbocharger. Heck try some forged pistons and a nitros power shot if you want to. That's just where I come out on it. I'm not saying the CAI and tuner thing doesn't have its place, but after looking into the matter, it just seems like a lot of cash for very little in performance to me.

By the way, from what I understand, just switching your tune back to stock when a problem happens won't cover you. Apparently the PCM's hold a history and the Ford techs at your dealership can tell if you have changed your tune. So I'm told, but I haven't confirmed that yet.

PS, there were a whole lot of guys back in the 70's who were out there on the weekends tweaking their two barrel carbs on their 305 Camaros, but it didn't do them much good either.

MOOK3456

It's not an assumption, it's a fact, a custom tune (even a canned tune to lesser degrees) increases performance, shift points/air/fuel/timing/etc... as well as giving you a diagnostic tool, data logging (in some cases) so you have full control/monitoring over how your vehicle operates...

You're not exactly right when you say it's all about the mechanics (obviously you can only squeeze so much out of what you have, but it can be squeezed). Cars have evolved and the brain is telling everything what to do, when, how and how much to do it. Of course you get gains from this, it's not even debatable.

The stock tune on your car is set to be conservative so there is less chance of failure as well as being able to boast the highest possible mpg when advertising the vehicle.

You reference sct's website and claims of gains. I'll remind you that those aren't custom tunes. They're canned (still fairly conservative mpg friendly tunes).

Here's a dyno sheet from a canned 91 oct predator tune vs stock....



9 hp on a canned 91 tune... I don't understand how you can think it's some scam that doesn't do anything. Google some custom tune dyno's.

You're just very mistaken. And how can you say a tune is worthless and then suggest a super charger/turbo/etc..? You gonna run that on the stock tune are ya?

Whitehorse10

According to who it's conservative? The guys selling you tuners maybe? My car is supposed to get 18 /26 but I'm averaging 21 around town and still able to hit 60 mph in 6.5 secs.

I didn't say it doesn't do anything. I just said it's not a lot of gain for quite a bit of money. Couple that with the fact that you get to pay for more expensive fuel.

Advantage III Ford / GM / DCX Dealer Custom Tuning Software

+11 horsepower +22 foot pounds torque.

http://www.sctflash.com/products.php?PID=53&VID=669

I'm just reading it from their own website. Now if they deliver more than great, but what's the pricetag?

Again, I'm not saying a tune is worthless. I'm just saying that for me it's too much money for not enough gain. The supercharger / turbocharger mods that I mentioned will absolutely require the computer be retuned, but in those cases you aren't just tweaking the computer settings. In those cases you are making a mechanical change to the engine and of course that is going to need a tune to make it work properly.

I'm guessing this would be a bad time to say I'm not a big fan of adding a CAI. lol Ever looked at all the crap that is trapped in your paper filter when you change it out? Some of that just goes right on into the engine when those high flow conical filters.

Look I'm not trying to get you fellas that swear by tuners all upset. I'm just saying I think they aren't worth the hype and money. If I'm going to get better performance out of my mustang it's going to be something substantial, not a 9 or 10 hp deal for hundreds of dollars. I'd rather spend the 4 grand and push up well up over 300 hp. That's just me.

MOOK3456

I don't know what to say really except that if you have never tried it you just wouldn't understand. It makes the car a new animal. You can read the hp gains and say hmm, thats not much and I guess that's understandable. But what you aren't considering is when all the adjustments come together and you drive the car, it really is like night and day in the drivers seat.

I know you're not trying to start a pissing contest over tuners, neither am I. But people don't buy tuners for some placebo effect. The gains in overall performance are undeniable. You don't have to take my word for it, just ask anyone here who's done it.

As far as the cost, 300-400 may seem expensive to you but what would be an equal cost vs gains mod? There really are none. Again you're comparing a 400 dollar tuner to a 4k+ supercharger/turbo. Most can swing 400 bucks. 4-5k, not as many lol.

Whitehorse10

I hear what you're saying Mook and I'm sure there is a noticeable difference but heck I can tell a difference in my car just by switching from a dirty paper air filter to a fresh new one. Here's the thing, at least to me, what we now pay hundreds of dollars for by way of a tuner was once done for free with a screw driver and a little patience. Modern cars don't have distributors or carbs. Back in the day when you wanted to play around with your air fuel ratio or adjust your timing you just used a screwdriver to adjuts the carb jets or you loosened your distributor cap and turned it ever so slightly to either advance or retard the timing. Most guys did a combination of both and the result was the same thing that we now achieve via a tuner that we pay 3 or 4 hundred dollars for. I understand that with respect to the automatics it also adjusts the shift points and that is a good thing. Once cars no longer used a mechanical means to achieve timing the computers took over and I'm not damning the computers, they're awesome and they actually do a lot better job than the old way of doing things. But essentialy what we are doing is paying hundreds of dollars for an electronic screwdriver. lol I would never tell you guys not to buy a tuner because car guys are going to tweak their cars, thats just the way it is and God bless you for it. I wish we had more car guys in this country. I'm just saying I personally don't think the cost vs gain ratio is good enough for me. I'd rather spend the big bucks on the mods I mentioned before. And now if you'll excuse me I'm going to go read this thread about comp cams for the 4.0. lol