Header question
07-20-2005, 11:07 PM
#11
I ♥ Acer
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location:
Posts: 9,172
RE: Header question
After having LTs on my car I can honestly say I loved them, but I will probably go to equal lengths from here on out. LTs are just way to much trouble and the way I drive I go through clutches in no time.
07-20-2005, 11:37 PM
#12
2nd Gear Member
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location:
Posts: 288
RE: Header question
This makes the first time in history that shorties are getting the recognition they deserve! I have ceramic coated BBK shorties, and I must say they are VERY well designed. The FRPP ones look like stockers to me, but I may just be biased towards the BBKs.
07-21-2005, 12:07 AM
#13
5th Gear Member
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Georgia
Posts: 2,387
RE: Header question
Nah, they look somewhat stock, but they have 1 5/8 tubes and 2.5 collectors. If I could get equal length with the Jet Hot for less than a frigin' fortune, I'd have 'em. That settles it, I'm going FRPP. Thanks for the feedback folks. Now, I have to count my pennies, ha ha ha ha.
(Married math: wife + wife's college + 2(kids) + my college + work + investments = very little cash and no spare time)
Can I get an AMEN?
(Married math: wife + wife's college + 2(kids) + my college + work + investments = very little cash and no spare time)
Can I get an AMEN?
07-21-2005, 02:49 PM
#14
2nd Gear Member
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location:
Posts: 485
RE: Header question
ORIGINAL: 98UAGT
Oh, people will say shorties cost you power. Just do a search on headers in this forum. You will find PLENTY of posts. There are a plethora of people that have condemned shorties b/c of one dyno sheet.
Oh, people will say shorties cost you power. Just do a search on headers in this forum. You will find PLENTY of posts. There are a plethora of people that have condemned shorties b/c of one dyno sheet.
I'm not sure anyone doubts they make more HP, it's just over 4500RPMs, they lose HP below which is where I do my driving, I don't know about you
Oh and it was 2 dyno sheets, one on a stock motor, one with a few bolt ons, and 2 different brands....I don't know how you can argue with that other than saying your butt meter says it feels faster, and it probably does that's because the 5 you gain at 5000 feels like more because you have to climb out of the HP loss below so it is a bigger swing in HP..
I'll save you the search..
ORIGINAL: Blue70
A few months ago in 5.0 Magazine they tested a set of the BBK short tubes and lost horsepower and torque below 4000RPM (where they admitted they can’t afford to lose any) but made more above.
I was wondering if headers would be worth the trouble, but after reading that article I'll wait until I have a few mods that will benefit from the headers, because we all know the 4.6 is can not afford to lose any more torque! I do 99.7% of my driving below 4000RPM, so I would have lost power 99.7% of the time [>:] How often do you cruise at over 4000RPM?
Here is what it did on the dyno after the header install
Peak HP before 237
after 242
Total peak gain 5
Peak TQ before 274
after 276
Total TQ gain 2
Hardly seems worth it on a basicly stock GT
But anyone that knows anything knows peak numbers mean nothing at all
so here is the curve.
RPM HP TQ
2400 -4 +2
2600 -3 +3
2800 -4 +1
3000 -5 +0
3200 -7 -4
3400 -8 -5
3600 -10 -7
3800 -7 -3
4000 -5 -0
4200 -3 +2
4400 -1 +5
4600 +2 +9
4800 +5 +11
5000 +5 +11
5200 +6 +11
5400 +6 +10
5600 +7 +10
5800 +7 +9
That's the problem, the HP is getting moved to were I will not use it, give me something to get some more grunt down low where the 2v needs it and I would be all over it, but you can see it hurt the car below 4000RPM which is where I do 99% of my driving.
All I am saying is I can't see dropping all that cash for headers, and going through the PITA that it is to install them just to lose power where I will use it..Even if I were to gain 10HP across the board, I'm not sure it's worth the hassle and cost ($399 plus labor) to do it, untill there was nothing left to do, 10HP is debatable whether or not it would be felt in the SOTP.
On a car with a few bolt ons I'm sure the numbers would look better, butthe car tested already had an X-pipe, Cat back, and CAI, and it looks like you'll need a bit more than that to get the most out of the headers. If you had some head work, cams, or forced induction, I'm sure it would help a lot. Just not for me at this point in time
A few months ago in 5.0 Magazine they tested a set of the BBK short tubes and lost horsepower and torque below 4000RPM (where they admitted they can’t afford to lose any) but made more above.
I was wondering if headers would be worth the trouble, but after reading that article I'll wait until I have a few mods that will benefit from the headers, because we all know the 4.6 is can not afford to lose any more torque! I do 99.7% of my driving below 4000RPM, so I would have lost power 99.7% of the time [>:] How often do you cruise at over 4000RPM?
Here is what it did on the dyno after the header install
Peak HP before 237
after 242
Total peak gain 5
Peak TQ before 274
after 276
Total TQ gain 2
Hardly seems worth it on a basicly stock GT
But anyone that knows anything knows peak numbers mean nothing at all
so here is the curve.
RPM HP TQ
2400 -4 +2
2600 -3 +3
2800 -4 +1
3000 -5 +0
3200 -7 -4
3400 -8 -5
3600 -10 -7
3800 -7 -3
4000 -5 -0
4200 -3 +2
4400 -1 +5
4600 +2 +9
4800 +5 +11
5000 +5 +11
5200 +6 +11
5400 +6 +10
5600 +7 +10
5800 +7 +9
That's the problem, the HP is getting moved to were I will not use it, give me something to get some more grunt down low where the 2v needs it and I would be all over it, but you can see it hurt the car below 4000RPM which is where I do 99% of my driving.
All I am saying is I can't see dropping all that cash for headers, and going through the PITA that it is to install them just to lose power where I will use it..Even if I were to gain 10HP across the board, I'm not sure it's worth the hassle and cost ($399 plus labor) to do it, untill there was nothing left to do, 10HP is debatable whether or not it would be felt in the SOTP.
On a car with a few bolt ons I'm sure the numbers would look better, butthe car tested already had an X-pipe, Cat back, and CAI, and it looks like you'll need a bit more than that to get the most out of the headers. If you had some head work, cams, or forced induction, I'm sure it would help a lot. Just not for me at this point in time
ORIGINAL: Blue70
In the new Muscle Mustangs and Fast Fords they tested a set of Kooks 1-5/8" LT's and gained 11 HP, and gains were from 2500 up. Much better than shorties, but worth the cost and effort, only you can decide.
They also tested a set of FFRP shorty headers and confirmed my thoughts. They only made 3-4 HP over stock headers on a stock 4.6 and about the same results as the modified 4.6 with BBK's, the gains were only from 4000RPM's up to 4800RPM's and again from 5500RPM's to 5700RPM's
In the new Muscle Mustangs and Fast Fords they tested a set of Kooks 1-5/8" LT's and gained 11 HP, and gains were from 2500 up. Much better than shorties, but worth the cost and effort, only you can decide.
They also tested a set of FFRP shorty headers and confirmed my thoughts. They only made 3-4 HP over stock headers on a stock 4.6 and about the same results as the modified 4.6 with BBK's, the gains were only from 4000RPM's up to 4800RPM's and again from 5500RPM's to 5700RPM's
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