Portmaster

hahahahahahaha!!!!!! Yeah right, Turbos, blowers and Nitrous on a street car are for those who want to go the easy route or don't know how to build an engine.In any case it's just a matter of getting air in and out. The street carb I was refering to was the "HP Street" it's not your run of the mill 750. Building HP is easy, it's just a matter of getting the engine to spin fast enough. It may not be a good street engine but 500 hp is a cake walk. AFR 185's flow plenty of air for 500hp on a 306. Now while you may need to get this engine to 3000 rpm before a full release of the clutch at a stoplight and low end torque would be pretty much non-exsistant once above 4500 rpm it would pin you to the seat right up past 7500 rpm. There are some good off the shelf parts out there. The biggest limit you have is the strength of the block.
You can build a 445 fwHp 302 (proven engine combo) with nothing more than a 10-1 compression short block
AFR 185 heads
Comp XE266HR cam
Out of the box RPM Air Gap
HP Holley 650
1.75 long tubes

There is nothing exotic about this engine and would make great power all around and would never have to exceed 6200rpm. another 55 hp isn't hard to get with a solid roller, single plane intake, more carb, 1.5 bump in compression and 1300 more rpm

I guess the next thing youre going to tell me you can't build a 12.1 compression 358 cubic inch engine with a FLAT Tappet cam and 830 cfm carb that can produce well over 750hp without a supercharger, Nitrous or blower.

wowvfast

dude not even close

wowvfast

it's not the easy route it's really more practical with sucky gas...their just more user friendly and very tame on the street even for a DD car....don't get me wrong I'm old skool but ever since I built my first turbo engine 355 sbc back in the early 90's I have been hooked...

Portmaster

Don't get me wrong, I'm a fan of any kind of power no matter how you make it and once you get up into 1000+ Hp it gets a little harder to keep pushing it without some kind of power adder or exotic fuel. My point was that a 500hp(at the flywheel) 306 is neither impossible nor difficult to do these days. It's just a matter of buying parts that work. If it wasn't for the fact I'm sure I'd split my block in my 347 I'd throw in a XE292R solid roller cam, Super Victor Intake and a Holley HP830 cfm carb and not only would make well over 600hp but the torque output would be well over 500ftbls. The reason I went with a production block was to keep me from doing that very thing. My Block set the limits and even then it has me a bit worried.

PJC Racing

Well here's a total contradiction. So which one is easy?

With off the shelf parts and nothing done to them, that's right. Nice try with the NASCAR thing though, yeah they use real off the sheft parts. Give me a break.

PJC Racing

OK "fade", I thought you were refering to the 500hp easy theory. Now if you look at what the OP listed for parts, the fuel system alone will NOT support 475hp.

grabbem88

i know my dss pro bullet 306 made over 330/340 rwhp with a slipping centerforce clutch in front of a tko

but are we really worried about how much it makes or what it does down the track? if you are stuck on "what it makes" then you'll just get dissapointed every time you start that car.

my motor wasn't a king nor a turd,but i was happy with it and that is all that matters i could go to the track tag 11's and drive it back home(2hr drive) and still get 22 mpg.

who cares how much you can get out of a 306 unless that is "your" goal.

you have decent parts other than the 24's,but every motor is different i had 100% duty cycle before 5500rpm your's might be ok. time will tell.

good luck! art

Portmaster

I said it was easy to build a 500hp 306 with off the shelf parts. For people who don't know how to get the air in and out artificial atmosphere gets introduced. You said it couldn't be done without a power adder and I know it can.

As far as the NASCAR referance goes they have some pretty strict engine guidelines they have to follow. I use to work for Ellington Racing (Nascar team owned by Hoss Ellington) Although Nascar now uses a better head than we did back in the 70's& 80's my mentor and teacher at that time Runt Pittman Showed me that It wasn't the free for all many people think it is. We wernt using SB2 heads and such back then. I saw many an engine go on the dyno that made over 700hp from 355 cubic inches back then. There are lots of little tricks to make power that add up to big power. Nascar engines while custom built are not as exotic as you might think. Despite all the tricks it's still a N/A pushrod V8 with a flat tappet cam and a single four barrel carb and no power adders.

Portmaster

a N/A engine requires a lot less injector than a boosted engine. 24 lb injectors could get it there. It's pushing the outer limits though.

PJC Racing

I'm not buying what you you're sellin. And I never said a 500hp 302 could not be had without a power adder. I am saying it can not be done with ALL off the shelf out of the box parts. But I can be honest, maybe that's too broad of a statement, there may be a VERY FEW out there. But they would certainly be NOT done easily. Can’t say I ever saw one though. Yes there are several +500hp 302's and smaller out there but they were not done easily and with ALL out of the box parts.

And just as you said, "Nascar engines WHILE CUSTOM built are not as exotic as you might think"

I think we (YOU) need to define what an off the shelf part is. Here's mine: Mass produced, out of the box and on/in the engine.