Hi CrazyAl,

Dang, we are cosmic twins on some stuff! It's weird man. Do you do paintball?

Cheers/Chip

 

F1,
Thanks for taking the time to offer your input, but do us all a favor and try to resist the urge to lecture. My opinions are based on plenty, and if I thought that answering your questions would somehow benefit other readers, I'd do so, but not just to entertain you, or your idea of what's common courtesy or respect. You write long winded, repetitiveanaswers that can usually be summerized in a few sentences, and you talk down to people in an insulting, passive-aggressiveway and frankly, I think it's terribly condescending and disrespectful. Lets leep the personal aspect out of the conversation, and stick with the technical topic.
Maybe you could take a more constructive approach to the coilover subject, and with your vast knowledge and experience (meant sincerely) start a thread on "Proper tuning of a coil over suspension" targeted specifically for the Mustang guys. Ther are those of us who aren't kids on a budget. You could offer constructiev input in that manner, and let the guys and their budgets worry about weather or not coilovers are "practical" for their project. At least that way, even the guy with more $ than brains has a chance to understand the basics.
I think I'll just build a double A arm drop in K member with an inverted coilover, and ditch the strut.
I'm done here.

 

Hi steelcomp,

Hmm,I thoughtfully answer your postcomplete with the reasoning behind how I got there and where I'm going andthis is what I get in return?As usual you have contributed absolutely no original thought or significant input to the thread just more whining and complaining about what I wrote.Why do you think people would not be interested in what you have to sayor whereyou got your ideas from just post them and let us decide for ourselves if you have anything worth listening to. I'm sure that they can tune out anything that sets off their B.S. meters.The truth is that every time you post I'm entertained byhowmanywords you can usewhile saying nothing at all that would contribute to the subject thread.

The proper tuning of a coilover suspension? How would that be any different than tuning a MacP suspension on a S197 for the average guy without scalesor even simple alignment tools? 99.9% of the people here are taking their cars to a local alignment shop for alignment if they are even getting an alignment done at all. Why would I bother to write a piece on tuning a coilover setup for people without coilovers?

If you could afford a better car you would have bought it, old guy or not. If you have the skills and resources to design and fab a new subframe (andan SLAwill need a new subframe), andSLA withproper modern sedanracing geometry foran S197 chassis do it. Thenrace it to prove it works and I will be your biggest promoterand you will make a lot of money selling it. Please do this for us alland when you are done build an IRS for the rear of the car too. My B.S. meter ispegged after reading this newclaim of yours.

WhileI think that everyone else hereis done with youI willbe waiting for yourbrilliant yet somehow empty response to this post.


HTH [sm=icon_cheers.gif]

 

I'm new here, not inexperienced, though. I'm enjoying the conversation along with the info. Just thought I'd add a couple of things to an old argument.

F1 rightly says there are no excellent level-one coilovers (aka remote reservoir preload,damping, and rebound adjustable) readily available to the public at the moment. With any luck and a lot of pressure perhaps Ohlins could be persuaded..? But that doesn't mean that ALL coilovers are a waste of time. It's true that for most people they really aren't a necessity. It's also true that most people won't have a clue about how to properly set them up, at least initially.

But there's another truth associated with a better quality suspensions and their available adjustments. That is, perceived ride quality and controlversus stock "take what they gave you and be happy with it."

I learned my suspension from motorcycles, where engines lagged far behind cars for years while suspension technology was light years ahead. Damping, suspension height, rebound, fluidqualities, fluid control, spring rates, and preload rates are instantly understandable with motorcycles as opposed to cars, because you can feelany changes you makedirectly in the seat of your pants, immediately. If you're sharing your bike with others of different weights or riding styles, each of these elements is important, noticable and with current technology tunable to provide the right level of compliance and grip regardless of the rider's style or weight. That's available only because of the quality of the suspension, including the shock and spring arrangement, which at the rear of a upper level sport bike, is almost invariably a coilover setup.

Learning how to use the adjustments available on the systems isn't rocket science, 'tho it can be defined in such terms if somebody needs it to understand what's going on underneath their ***. What is essential, regardless of the terms chosen, is an understanding of what spring rates, spring preload, damping and rebound actually mean in physical terms. Add more preload, you decrease your spring travel and increase the level of damping required to soften the bump and at the same time may require a decrease in rebound rate to keep the suspension from lifting too fast and decreasing tire contact patch. Blah blah blah, and it goes on in such boring fashion. But if you're confident of your understanding of each element and how they affect your ride, then you can slowly "tune" your suspension to give yourself excellent results.

None of this is possible if the products that provide for these adjustments aren't there. And true, if you never actually push your product, you might not even realize you could benefit from something better. But simply stated, with even a basic understanding of suspensions and average adjustment skills, there is NO time when a less worthy product is a better choice when it comes to actually putting your car on the track or road. Real world experience with a better quality suspension is essential, and basic knowledge is as well. But the idea that we should all just settle for a set of stock springs and D-Specs is over the top, for me.

There are manufacturers making decent coilovers for the S197, although at the moment we lack the abundance of choices being offered to many imports. And it's true you won't get as much of an advantage out of some of the tunablity on the live axle rear of the 'stang as you do off of more sophisticated suspensions. But if you're serious about your performance and like to push the edge on the track ANY improvement is better than none at all, and just might be what keeps you out of the grass on turn five.

 

 

F1Fan

Sorry to revive this ancient thread, but I was wondering what you thought of the new Steeda coilovers.

Are you still using D-Specs?