I have driven many BMWs with the stability and traction control on and off and the difference between their systems and Fords system is huge. Ford's system will still let you spin the tires enough to get the car sideways even on dry roads and only cuts power to help you maintain control. BMW's systems when fully engaged will not allow any sort of slip angle or anything more than a tire chirp. They have an intermediate mode that allows some tire slip, but it still catches you if you get a little crazy as long as physics allows. It will brake individual wheels in order to apply torque moments to correct under or over steer before the driver even notices that the car has begun to lose grip. I always leave the TC off in my stang b/c it doesnt intervene quick enough to actually help you unless you are a total idiot.

 

argonaut,

i would think that those driving all those performance cars fully deactivate their stability and traction controls. i know all it takes is pushing the DTC button in our e90 for 3 secs and stability control is fully deactivated.

having said that, if i'm driving my $60k+ m3 on a track, i could see leaving the safety systems on..

 

The 2005-09 TCS does not also include stability control, so I don't see how it could help you on the track. My tuner was quick to mention that I turn off the TCS when I want to have fun, which I have regularly obeyed when releasing my inner juvenile delinquent.

 

Ran all 3 days at the Glen with it off this weekend - would never go back to on ! The car reacts like its supposed to with it off - very predictable & controllable feeling. Car feels like its fighting me with it on.

 

+1 on that.

 

The e90 m3 has M-dynamic mode in the DSC. This lets you get a decent amount of slip to where you think you are in trouble. However, it is holding you at that angle and wont let you get too out of control. Its an amazing system that i wish was available on all cars.

 

Would it hold you back to the same limits if you upgraded the tires to, say R-compounds or even the better "Street Touring" tires?

Basically I am a bit skeptical about anything that introduces arbitrary limits on vehicle performance, particularly when it does so by getting itself involved between me and the tire contact patches. I can fix a limitation determined by tire model choice (and I know that OE tire choice has been used to limit certain performance aspects in certain vehicles) or other mechanical specs.

I'm a lot afraid that technologies such as this could be used to limit the way I drive without first obtaining my consent. Maybe even do so progressively. Anything that can be programmed . . . can be reprogrammed, and the mfr and his dealers certainly hold the better hand in this card game.


Norm

 

I turn mine off routinely unless it's raining or any other kind of slippery. I've noticed significant performance issues, mainly RPM wind-up, when I hammer it with the TCS on.

 

is the TCS still somewhat engaged when you turn it off on the dash or is it completely deactivated?

 

I'd like to believe that when I turn it to "OFF" that it's "OFF" and not "SOMEWHAT OFF"...