vbstang13

I had asked this in the 05-13 tech section; lots of looks but only a couple of responses. I thought I might get a bit more input here, so here it is:

Took my 05 Saleen to the dealer because I was getting a loud clunking sound out of the front end when on rough and bumpy roads and I also asked them to check the front end alignment.

I originally thought it might need new struts. End result no struts needed they just tightened everything up according to the TSB (that I had to show them).

Here is where it seems to get crazy to me. The Service Tech said "To align the front end properly and to get the wheels straight up and down the struts needed to be elongated". Which they said "involved drilling into the strut" and stretching in some manner bringing it through the top of the tower. Also they said the "lower control arm needed to be elongated and repositioned to adjust the caster". Sounded like a Frankenstein project to me, so I said no way!

The suspension is the same as it came from Saleen when it was brand new.

I'm looking to you guys for your expert opinions has anyone else heard of or experienced a similar situation?
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Norm Peterson

Some questions are not so easily answered, and yours needs people to have Saleen-specific alignment information available (which I do not have) in order to get a truly useful response. I left a couple of suggestions in your other thread. Maybe Jazzer can come up with something.


Norm

Jazzer The Cat

I will "reluctantly" help you, as you are a Yankee fan

I know there was an issue with the front sway-bar making noise on the early S197 models, but sounds like they checked that. As for "aligning the front end properly" this could mean to OEM specs, which of course, are not what Saleen had planned for your car. In addition, a bit of extra caster over OEM, is just what the doctor ordered for your current 9" wheels, since the OEM ones were 8". I don't believe that Saleen installed CC plates, but I do not know for sure.

I would ask you to confirm with the tech as to what alignment specs he/she is looking to achieve?

Jazzer

vbstang13

Norm Peterson Yes, I just saw that and replied. Thank You, I appreciate you taking the time!

Jazzer I was born a Yankee fan, can't help it, thanks for looking past that.

I was familiar with the TSB on the sway bar and end links, it just took 7yrs for mine to work loose. So that was fixed properly after I showed the tech the TSB I downloaded to my phone( just for that reason).

You are correct the tech was going off Ford specs and did not base it on what Saleen had done to modify the suspension when new. CC plates are not on the car but I'm going to look into having them installed by someone who knows Saleens. You are the one of a few people who have suggested them today. The only thing they did was a toe in/out adjustment, I didn't want them to do anything else. Thanks for your input, it is appreciated.

Jazzer The Cat

OK, I forgive you... he he (In regards to the alignment person here) I think it sad that one is working on a car designed for improved performance, yet does not even understand that the owner of such a car "might" wish to accept some additional tire wear to maintain the peformance he/she payed to have. You may/may not, but this person should understand this and afford you the option and not just automatically "default" to OEM specs without question

Regardless of your looking for OEM specs or improve front-end grip, CC plates are the way to go. They will add a bit of NVH to your driving experience, but well worth the benefits they provide. ***HERE*** are the '95 specs, but don't imagine they have changed much, as without plates, one cannot do a whole lot anyway. ***HERE*** is some addtional information and some from Norm a few years back In conclusion, how you drive your car, should determine the specs you run:

OEM specs = extended tire life at the somewhat expense of front end grip
more neg. camber & positive caster = improved lateral grip, but somewhat shortened tire life (can be helped by regular rotation)

If you purchased a Saleen, it would be my expectation that you would want improved lateral grip beyond an OEM ride, so installing CC plates and going after more than OEM neg. camber and some additional positive caster, would be a good thing

Jazzer

vbstang13

Jazzer;

You are absolutely correct; the reason I bought the Saleen was mainly for the added performance capabilities and the exclusiveness of a low production run. Sacrificing a little more tire wear is a good trade off for me. Heck my first set on the Saleen lasted twice as long as the original tires I had on my stock 99GT.

I am not as knowledgeable as most on here but I do know what I want and that is why I have purchased the vehicles I currently own. It is bothersome that a tech in some cases knows less about my vehicle than I do sometimes. I am very picky about my cars and really keep tabs on the people that service them and I ask a ton of questions.

The CCplates sound like a great idea the more I look into it. I appreciate your input and Norm's; I've learned a lot more.

Thanks for the great info!

Norm Peterson

What I've found is that most techs get to be pretty good at doing what I call "standard jobs". IOW, those for which the basic factory shop manual procedures (or the insider's shortcuts) can be followed precisely and for which the factory specs are completely appropriate. It's the off-the-wall jobs like this recent one of yours that call for a somewhat deeper understanding that many techs either have trouble grasping the theory behind, or (just as bad) have trouble understanding why you'd even want something set outside the factory specs.

Seems your guys saw a problem that didn't really exist (not bad, in and of itself, just not necessarily applicable), but at least had some idea how to proceed had you been a typical customer with an 'average' car in for all standard work.

A smart service writer will do his best to assign work to an individual with the appropriate levels of skill and understanding, but that's not always possible (and it does depend on the writer's own understanding of whatever it is that you're trying to get across and whether he thinks you know what you're talking about). Sometimes you just can't quite break through the "We're the experts here, just tell us what's wrong and let us do our job" attitude that can and does develop.


I've probably got a little bit better basis for this opinion than most folks (who are apt to have been soured by one or more bad experiences as customers). I worked out of the service department of a Chevy dealership for about a year. Not as a tech, but close enough to be out on the floor enough to observe what goes on and get a feel for who the really sharp guys were (the "A-techs"), those who should stick to just basic stuff (the "C's"), and who might be on a track to move up (some of the "B" guys). In addition, my son-in-law bounced around among various independent shops for about 15 years years before getting out of the business to get his Class A CDL (he's a nice enough guy, but I still can't tell/teach him much, either).


Norm