Cold Air Intake?
09-24-2007, 03:47 PM
#11
2nd Gear Member
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: PA
Posts: 242
RE: Cold Air Intake?
ORIGINAL: Ellik
JLT is the ****! Im just disappointed that they call their RAI a 'ram-air' kit, since it is not at all. No idea about the CAI making the supercharger whine louder. I had an SLP CAI on a firebird though It wasnt SC'ed. but itdefinately made a bit of noise sucking in air... they arent baffled like stock units.
JLT is the ****! Im just disappointed that they call their RAI a 'ram-air' kit, since it is not at all. No idea about the CAI making the supercharger whine louder. I had an SLP CAI on a firebird though It wasnt SC'ed. but itdefinately made a bit of noise sucking in air... they arent baffled like stock units.
09-24-2007, 04:19 PM
#12
2nd Gear Member
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location:
Posts: 315
RE: Cold Air Intake?
NO. what you are talking about is a cold air kit. I cant remember the comany name, but I think there is a cold air kit that is named 'Short Ram', and now obviously JLT calls their kit a 'ram air' kit, even though it is not.
a RAM AIRsetup issomething more specific. I think it was coined in the early 70's as an intake package offered on some of the muscle cars. These were the setups that had functional 'nostrils' in the hoods that conneted to the carbs. Kind of like the shaker setup on the modern Mach's. Aftermarket setupshave some kind ofductworkfrom thethrottle bodyto the front side fo the vehicle with some kind of air scoop, either designed into the hood, or a removed foglight or something like that. I've even seen crappy sheet metal scoops dangling under the front bumper with ductwork connecting them. The idea is that the faster your go, the more air is going to be forced into the scoop and directed into the engine. why do you think they call them 'Ram-Air' style hoods.
google 'ram air' and you will see what Im talking about.
The non-fenderwell style air intake setups cannot get enough air to get a 'ram air' effect, and trying to call them that is just a marketing gimmick as far as Im concerned. Maybe if you removed the headlight for a pass down the track or something.
Im not saying that a ram-air setup is any better than a good CAI, in most cases I dont think they are, but a cold-air kit IS NOT the same as a ram-air setup.
a RAM AIRsetup issomething more specific. I think it was coined in the early 70's as an intake package offered on some of the muscle cars. These were the setups that had functional 'nostrils' in the hoods that conneted to the carbs. Kind of like the shaker setup on the modern Mach's. Aftermarket setupshave some kind ofductworkfrom thethrottle bodyto the front side fo the vehicle with some kind of air scoop, either designed into the hood, or a removed foglight or something like that. I've even seen crappy sheet metal scoops dangling under the front bumper with ductwork connecting them. The idea is that the faster your go, the more air is going to be forced into the scoop and directed into the engine. why do you think they call them 'Ram-Air' style hoods.
google 'ram air' and you will see what Im talking about.
The non-fenderwell style air intake setups cannot get enough air to get a 'ram air' effect, and trying to call them that is just a marketing gimmick as far as Im concerned. Maybe if you removed the headlight for a pass down the track or something.
Im not saying that a ram-air setup is any better than a good CAI, in most cases I dont think they are, but a cold-air kit IS NOT the same as a ram-air setup.
09-24-2007, 04:32 PM
#13
2nd Gear Member
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: PA
Posts: 242
RE: Cold Air Intake?
Oh well I didn't know your talking about the hoods. I just meantthe intake itself being in the engine bay, making it a short ram with heat shield opposed to a cold air where the intake is directed to the wheel well for colder air.
09-25-2007, 07:10 AM
#14
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 14
RE: Cold Air Intake?
I put the true cold air intake on my car. It runs into the fenderwell. It's sort of a pain in the *** to put in but not too bad. You may have to move around some of your air pump hoses to get the filter to fit in there right without hittin anything. There is one tube coming off my air pump that has a cap on the end, and it wants to sit right where my filter should go. After you get ur filter in the fender you can figure out what to put in that huge hole your gonna have where the old filter housing goes.
Anyway. Back to the real question. Just like most people are already saying. The true cold air intake is supposed to be the best. It will also produce a few extra hp when u add a procharger, or whatever type of forced induction you might want to go for. Of course you have intercoolers too that are awesome.
Anyway. Back to the real question. Just like most people are already saying. The true cold air intake is supposed to be the best. It will also produce a few extra hp when u add a procharger, or whatever type of forced induction you might want to go for. Of course you have intercoolers too that are awesome.
09-25-2007, 10:27 PM
#16
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 4
RE: Cold Air Intake?
I hope this adds some clarity. Below is one of the FAQ from the Suncoast Automotive Performance webiste.
************************************************** *************************
Q: I have a cold air intake already. After I install your [ram air] hood, how well do I need to seal the air path?
A: The answer to that question really is a matter of degree and what you want from your hood. The first phase would be to not worry about sealing the air path. Your new Suncoast hood will provide a clean path for the cold air from above the hood to justabove the intake box in the engine compartment. GM engineers ran some tests with one of our Silverado hoods to see if they would getboth a boost in Hp and a cooling effect in the engine compartment if they did not seal the path. Their conclusion was to not seal the path. They got enough of a Hp boost by providing that cold air in the vicinity of the air intake and blowing away some or all of the hot air from that area. That alsogave them theexcess cold air being forced into the engine compartment to cool engine compartment electronics. Their installation recommendation to their dealersis using an open air path. They want the extra cool air in the engine compartment so they can cool some of their electronics that are concerned with on their big diesel in the hot months. Running your hood and cold air intake without a sealed path is much like blowing on the hot coals of a campfire. They glow brighter with the added fresh air flow.
The next phase of improvement is segregation. Keep the hot air out of your intake. Of course, the better the segregation the better the performance. With a ram air system, the effect on performanceand the level of separation basically becomes a function of speed. At a standstill, in addition to the cold air brought in through the ram air path and the normal air path, small amounts of hot air from the engine compartment could be sucked through openings in and around the heat shield. Once the vehicle is moving forward and the ram effect is pushing fresh cold air into the intake compartment, It will also eventually overpower any sucking effect from the engine and the excess pressure will not only push air through the air filter but also push the hot air away from any openings in the heat shield.
The ultimate in performance is the next phase, a truly sealed air path. This is an air path were we can contain that pressure generated by the forward motion and force cold air from the hood scoop through the filter media. The better the seal the higher the pressure it will allowand the better the Hp boost.
But now lets move beyond this "text book" answer in this last phase. Is your cold air intake sealed now? No. It is open to the normal air intake path. If you leave that open, which is wise to do, and add another opening for the ram air from the hood, the actual pressure increase generated around the filter is due to the opposing force of the cold air from the hood flowing into the top of the intake and the mixture of cold and hot air flowing in from the fender well opening on the side or bottom. At a stand still, you've effectively doubled the cold air "throat" of your intake. At speed, the cold air from the hood and the warm air from the fender well will quickly overpower any hot air from the engine compartment that leaks through the heat shields. As your speed increases, the cold air from the hood air path will eventually overpower the warm air coming from the fender. I want to run a test to determine if it makes more sense to actually close off the fender intake or should it be left open. As soon as I get some data, I'll be writing a magazine article on it.
So back to your question on how well does it need to seal. Unless you plan on closing the normal air intake path, you don't truly have a pressure vessel to gain 100% of the theoretical maximum ram effect at high speed anyway. Leaving the normal air intake path open allows for a ton of air available to the high flow filter allowing it to breath even easier regardless of speed (zero, low or high). Unless you're going for that last 100th of a second in your quarter mile, a reasonably sealed air path will minimize the effects of hot engine compartment air at most speeds and provide a reasonable amount of containment for the ram air pressure. Also,leaving both air paths available will give your engine its maximum "throat"at all speeds while still providing a good ram air effect at higher speeds.
One discussion on performance with both sides open is available at http://www.clubtitan.org/forums/show...hlight=ram+air
(Note: Many models of Suncoast Hoods interface using a sealed air path to the stock air box or through the use of a ram air replacement air box. These configurations offer the truest in ram air functionality. )
************************************************** *************************
Q: I have a cold air intake already. After I install your [ram air] hood, how well do I need to seal the air path?A: The answer to that question really is a matter of degree and what you want from your hood. The first phase would be to not worry about sealing the air path. Your new Suncoast hood will provide a clean path for the cold air from above the hood to justabove the intake box in the engine compartment. GM engineers ran some tests with one of our Silverado hoods to see if they would getboth a boost in Hp and a cooling effect in the engine compartment if they did not seal the path. Their conclusion was to not seal the path. They got enough of a Hp boost by providing that cold air in the vicinity of the air intake and blowing away some or all of the hot air from that area. That alsogave them theexcess cold air being forced into the engine compartment to cool engine compartment electronics. Their installation recommendation to their dealersis using an open air path. They want the extra cool air in the engine compartment so they can cool some of their electronics that are concerned with on their big diesel in the hot months. Running your hood and cold air intake without a sealed path is much like blowing on the hot coals of a campfire. They glow brighter with the added fresh air flow.
The next phase of improvement is segregation. Keep the hot air out of your intake. Of course, the better the segregation the better the performance. With a ram air system, the effect on performanceand the level of separation basically becomes a function of speed. At a standstill, in addition to the cold air brought in through the ram air path and the normal air path, small amounts of hot air from the engine compartment could be sucked through openings in and around the heat shield. Once the vehicle is moving forward and the ram effect is pushing fresh cold air into the intake compartment, It will also eventually overpower any sucking effect from the engine and the excess pressure will not only push air through the air filter but also push the hot air away from any openings in the heat shield.
The ultimate in performance is the next phase, a truly sealed air path. This is an air path were we can contain that pressure generated by the forward motion and force cold air from the hood scoop through the filter media. The better the seal the higher the pressure it will allowand the better the Hp boost.
But now lets move beyond this "text book" answer in this last phase. Is your cold air intake sealed now? No. It is open to the normal air intake path. If you leave that open, which is wise to do, and add another opening for the ram air from the hood, the actual pressure increase generated around the filter is due to the opposing force of the cold air from the hood flowing into the top of the intake and the mixture of cold and hot air flowing in from the fender well opening on the side or bottom. At a stand still, you've effectively doubled the cold air "throat" of your intake. At speed, the cold air from the hood and the warm air from the fender well will quickly overpower any hot air from the engine compartment that leaks through the heat shields. As your speed increases, the cold air from the hood air path will eventually overpower the warm air coming from the fender. I want to run a test to determine if it makes more sense to actually close off the fender intake or should it be left open. As soon as I get some data, I'll be writing a magazine article on it.
So back to your question on how well does it need to seal. Unless you plan on closing the normal air intake path, you don't truly have a pressure vessel to gain 100% of the theoretical maximum ram effect at high speed anyway. Leaving the normal air intake path open allows for a ton of air available to the high flow filter allowing it to breath even easier regardless of speed (zero, low or high). Unless you're going for that last 100th of a second in your quarter mile, a reasonably sealed air path will minimize the effects of hot engine compartment air at most speeds and provide a reasonable amount of containment for the ram air pressure. Also,leaving both air paths available will give your engine its maximum "throat"at all speeds while still providing a good ram air effect at higher speeds.
One discussion on performance with both sides open is available at http://www.clubtitan.org/forums/show...hlight=ram+air
(Note: Many models of Suncoast Hoods interface using a sealed air path to the stock air box or through the use of a ram air replacement air box. These configurations offer the truest in ram air functionality. )
09-26-2007, 07:34 PM
#17
5th Gear Member
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 3,625
RE: Cold Air Intake?
Nothing but a bunch of idiotic replies here!!! wow!!! I have a TRUE RAM AIR INTAKE. It is custom made by myself. I used 4" sewer pipe and a couple of 90* elbows. I glued the set-up to the air silencer from which I cut out so they would properly mate. I removed my passenger side foglight and have that hole as my air inlet. Well lets just say that I had to get my car tuned because it was running a little lean! I noticed big improvement from 30mph+. Not 1 prson has noticed my missing foglight! Ohh, I paid just about $16 for it too! Not counting the K&N filter.
09-27-2007, 07:12 AM
#19
2nd Gear Member
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 333
RE: Cold Air Intake?
IMO there is too much attention being paid to how the systems are named. Folks, you need to focus more on the benefits of each type and which you personally prefer. Either the RAI or CAI type will make power for you. CAIs (filter in fenderwell) will net you a bit more power than a RAI (filter in engine bay) due to the cooler air charge. However, there are trade-offs to consider. It is possible for a filter in the fenderwell to get wet, the system is more difficult to install correctly, and changing/cleaning the filter is a pain. And contrarary to what many say, a RAI setup can make excellent power, despite underhood heat. I had a Steeda RAI and with just a 2.90 upper, catback/midpipe and tune made 457rwhp and 480rwtq. Heat just never was a big factor for me. I tried a Densecharger CAI but tossed it simply because the filter wouldn't stay secure.
So if you prefer an easier installation and easier maintenance, just go with a good RAI like JLT's, or Steeda's, or K&N's. You won't be disappointed. If you are making big power and want/need a cooler air charge then go with the JLT CAI.
By the way, I totally agree that calling the setup with the filter in the engine bay a RamAirIntake is confusing. Not sure what other name you would call it. LOL! Again, names are just names. Pretty much everyone accepts the term RAI to cover these engine bay located setups. I would be more interested in how they perform for you.
So if you prefer an easier installation and easier maintenance, just go with a good RAI like JLT's, or Steeda's, or K&N's. You won't be disappointed. If you are making big power and want/need a cooler air charge then go with the JLT CAI.
By the way, I totally agree that calling the setup with the filter in the engine bay a RamAirIntake is confusing. Not sure what other name you would call it. LOL! Again, names are just names. Pretty much everyone accepts the term RAI to cover these engine bay located setups. I would be more interested in how they perform for you.
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
tj@steeda
Steeda Autosports
0
09-08-2015 11:50 AM
