Professor Wizard

Ford and GM pretty much have to rethink how they make cars and what quality measures they put into them, as well as deal with their labor issues.

Yea... they have labor issues, but they are far to quick to blame the unions.

Bottom line is... Why do the higher percent of people in the US purchase foreign cars over US Branded cars? No longer are the foreign cars cheaper alternatives to US cars – in many instances the overseas cars cost MORE then a US Car. (Go price a Honda lately?)

People are buying the foreign brands because they are perceived as Higher Quality and longer lasting when they are compared to US Cars.

An example is – When I was discussing my fog light issues with my neighbor, he exclaimed, “What did you expect? You bought an American Car, if you wanted better quality you should have bought a Nissan!”

US Cars are perceived as shoddy engineered and poor quality. US Branded Dealership are expected by the public to give poor service from the shop and the public believes that is what you will get with few exceptions.

Since I bought my Mustang, I have had to argue several issues – to no resolution I might add – about a few items on my car. Ford Customer Service told me, that these issues meet their specifications and they aren’t going to change anything. So – if Ford or GM won’t build a product to high specifications, then they lower their specifications to meet what they build!

I had a BMW before this and an AUDI before that and an Infiniti before the Audi. NEVER did the dealership or the manufacturer give me an argument about any issue I had with the car. They simply replaced the item and ask if I were Happy now! The dealerships were always accommodating. None of those cars really had any issues like the ones I dealt with concerning my Mustang.

IF the US Car makers are going to get their market back – the MUST make cars that are as good or better then their competition. If they do not do that, they will not survive. Chrysler is already appearing to “Take the Hint” being now owned by Daimler (Mercedes). They have drastically improved the quality of their production and materials. Although they still have a way to go to match up with their foreign counterparts, they are well on their way to getting there!

Right now, Ford and GM are taking the typical American Corporate attitude. Cut staff and dump assets to improve the bottom line and make the company appear more profitable, therein increasing your stock value. As a company, they really aren’t all that interested in making a BETTER car… they are interested in increasing their stock value while making a more profitable car… The aspects of design and manufacture for profitable cars are not the same thing as design and manufacturer of a high quality car. The ideology of decisions based on increasing stock value verses the ideology of decisions based on what will be best for the company, are contrastingly different concepts. One WILL give customers a car they wish to buy and the other will NOT. Which approach do you think Ford will take in the next few years?

LesteR723

i simply dont get it... how can toyota and Hyundai make their cars in america and THRIVE!!!, but ford and GM have to ship their **** overseas to be built? (for those of you who dont know, many "imports" are made here)

Daniel60

Hey everyone I enjoyed reading your opinions and for my 10 cents worth I enjoy my 05 Gt Mustang very much. To be more frank I'm obessed with it and I just hate to think one day I will not be able to purchase a new one because all these americans who drive imports who are in return shutting the american brands down. But hell this is America and it is a free market. It just will be a sad day in hell when we don't have anymore muscle cars like Mustangs, Corvettes, and yes the future Camaros and Challengers. Yes Dodge is now owned by Mercedes right? But it least is an American name with no doubt some american parts. Also I believe that ford is putting out a damn good cars and the F-150 is still the best selling vehicle in America. Do I believe Toyota belongs in NASCAR? Hell no I don't care if they make them in Kentucky or Indiana. It doesn matter. NASCAR IS AN AMERICAN SPORT. Do I drive imports NOPE. I drive a chevy before driving a Toyota,Honda,Kia, or whatever else. Thank you and good day.

viking396

The crap Chrysler sold to get out from under will never wash in todays market. Can you imagine a GM K-Car? Gives me the shivers just thinking about it...

97BlackStang

whats a GM-K car?

kartracer55

UAW is more to blame than any other single reason for the state these companies are in today. They are like a big ball and chain, demanding retarded wages for installing lugnuts and rediculous benifets. And of course, somebody will chime in here and say "no, thats wrong, its because of the quality" but guess what? US manufacturers have had to resort to importing parts to stay afloat because UAW has cost them so much, in turn, hurting the quality. It all falls down on the unions. There was a time when unions were necessary to protect the worker. Now, unions abuse the employer. Unions are hurting this country and they are very responsible for our current manufacturing state ... the whole "thats not my job, you have to pay him to do that even though im on the clock drinking coffee" metallity is screwing us over. Im all for fair wages, but honestly, not every job warrants a 40K a year salary and insane health benifets and pensions. UAW has to realize that they can ask for thier retardedly high wages and insane benifets NOW, but its going to f*ck them over in 10 years when they are all out of work. On the other hand, they can take a hit for the greater good of the company so they can have a job, health benifets and a secure futer in 10 years. Cant have both.

Jim

74stang2togo

He was making a joke, Chrysler built a lineup of cars from the early 80s to the mid 90s (and still use some of it's basic achitecture to this day) called "K-cars". They were known for smooth riding, good fuel economy, and no sense of reliability whatsoever. Chrysler sold MILLIONS of them, and people still buy used ones for reasons I can't fathom, but I don't complain because it keeps me in my job at the parts store I work at.

As bad as those cars were, they saved Chrysler (only for Chrysler to get bought out by Daimler-Benz in the mid 90s).

97BlackStang was implying that GM could get desperate enough to build such a car (actually, they already did, they just called it the "J-body", worst of which has to be the Pontiac Sunbird/Sunfire, followed closely by the Cadillac Cimmaron, at least the Chevy Cavalier had some redeeming options over the years, inlucing the Z24 option.)

Building crap like that is what is killing GM, for LESS than the price of a new Cobalt (the newest of the J-body GM cars), my sister just bought a Suzuki Reno (still a GM brand, but built in Korea, Australia, and Japan instead of here), which gets better gas mileage, has roughly equal performance, and has a LOT more options and a much better warranty, and my mom bought a Suzuki Grand Vitara after comparing the Ford Escape, Mazda Tribute, Honda Pilot, and Chevy Equinox. Same thing, better warranty, cheaper, more/better options, and good fuel economy (this thing seriously gets 24-28mpg on the highway with ME driving, it could hit 30 with mom behind the wheel.)

My mom and sister both traded in Fords after being 100% Ford-loyal their entire lives, because they couldn't find ANYTHING on the Ford or Ford-corporate lots they felt was a good value.

I've been diehard Ford/GM loyal since I turned 16, I've owned 7 GM (Chevy, Saturn, Pontiac) and 4 Ford products (3 Mustangs and a Thunderbird) personally (I'm 21 now), but I plan on my next purchase being either a Dodge Magnum, Charger, or Challenger (in '09) or a BMW, Honda, or Nissan.

bsdwork

Newbreedgt05, Mustangs are Mustangs. But japanese car are very good. I don't know what you would say something like that. Figure Toyota, Hyundai and so on. Those are extremely good cars!

Norm Peterson

Maybe so. But the two makes that you mention both project rather bland personalities. And since this is an enthusiast forum pretty much by definition, boring ho-hum cars aren't going to be held in high regardwith respect to the "fun factor"no matter how good they may be as transportation appliances. Mazda, Honda, and Nissan may be slightly better off in this respect, though Nissan's current trend toward fitting CVTs to just about everything may just manage to kick them over onto that other list. Unless you have some other overriding requirement (such as towing or seating for 7), life's too short to spend any of it driving something that you mostly just put up with.

As far as Toyota having Cup entries goes, I know via another forum of one individual who is now an engineer with one of those teams. Yes, they're still struggling. The bigger issues with Nextel Cup involve the C.O.T., and there's not much can be done about NASCAR's view that the show is more important than either the technology or the racinganyway.

Concerning what sort of car will end up in my driveway depends almost entirely on how well any of the various manufacturers can satisfy my needs at whatever stage in my life as well as my admittedly strong preferences involving what it takes to be"fun to drive". Always has - if I'm not convinced when I'm about to buy a particular car that I'll still be happy with it after the payment book is closed out, it doesn't get bought. So far, that's been Ford - Chevy - Nissan - Mazda - Nissan, spread out over 30+ years. Right now, there is no need for roomy 4/5 passenger accommodation in each of three cars(with only two drivers), so the '08 GT is on a very short list in the early stages of new car shopping.


Norm