WORTH IT??????????
6th Gear Member
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 7,445
From:
RE: WORTH IT??????????
ORIGINAL: cobra232
wow what misinformation
220rwhp and the 3.8 is maxed out in stock form???
my procharged 98 put down 227rwhp 267ftlbs with an 11psi procharger kit 1.8 rockers dual exhaust and STOCK 14lb injectors with procharger FMU on the first dyno session. it was just getting started. 450rwhp is attainable on a completely internally stock 3.8 and has been done and been proven long term reliable
my 99GT vert only put down 214rwhp 257ftlbs stock.
the ford 3.8 is a very stout block and capable of 1000hp with the proper upgrades. it was an improved modified copy of the stage 1 buick 231. it doesn't have the poor oiling system the buick had nor the usless block skirt nor the crappy shaftmounted easily deflected rockers. it was also an on-center block which eliminated the need for offset con rods like the buick needed. it has heads based on cleveland 2V heads which easily outflow and are much lighter than the buick's iron heads.
what ever can be done to a stage 1 buick it can be done to the ford 3.8 with better results splitport or singleport.
if his car was a 94-95 v6 that was prone to poppin head gaskets i'd say yeah sell it off and get a V8 but his 97 is a perfect foundation for serious HP
a singleport with the 11 psi kit pullied for 15psi 42lb injectors,SCT big air MAF and proper dyno tune along with a good exhaust and rearend with 4.10's and detroit truetrac will put out just shy of 300rwhp and 325ftlbs tq and that is without any engine mods. add RPM BV heads/intakes, 214/224cam or better 1.8 adj rockers and you are in the 340rwhp range on stock pistons/rods. if you are going to go that deep you might as well upgrade to forged rods and pistons and crank up the boost to 20psi or better yet start off with a turbo kit and build it from there.
i disagree with the statement that modding the 6 is more expensive that the 8 for the same power levels. i have both and won't even touch the 4.6 because it is waayyy too expensive to mod it compared to what i have spent on my 6
ORIGINAL: redass02gt
not worth swapping, and I don't think it's worth modding your 6 to get equal power as a GT, because in the end, you'll spend more on the 6er for equivalent power. not to mention that you will be close to maxing out your 6er at ~220whp, which is the starting point of a GT. I know some v6ers have more than 220rwhp, but will you need a built motor to go much higher than that.
not worth swapping, and I don't think it's worth modding your 6 to get equal power as a GT, because in the end, you'll spend more on the 6er for equivalent power. not to mention that you will be close to maxing out your 6er at ~220whp, which is the starting point of a GT. I know some v6ers have more than 220rwhp, but will you need a built motor to go much higher than that.
220rwhp and the 3.8 is maxed out in stock form???
my procharged 98 put down 227rwhp 267ftlbs with an 11psi procharger kit 1.8 rockers dual exhaust and STOCK 14lb injectors with procharger FMU on the first dyno session. it was just getting started. 450rwhp is attainable on a completely internally stock 3.8 and has been done and been proven long term reliable
my 99GT vert only put down 214rwhp 257ftlbs stock.
the ford 3.8 is a very stout block and capable of 1000hp with the proper upgrades. it was an improved modified copy of the stage 1 buick 231. it doesn't have the poor oiling system the buick had nor the usless block skirt nor the crappy shaftmounted easily deflected rockers. it was also an on-center block which eliminated the need for offset con rods like the buick needed. it has heads based on cleveland 2V heads which easily outflow and are much lighter than the buick's iron heads.
what ever can be done to a stage 1 buick it can be done to the ford 3.8 with better results splitport or singleport.
if his car was a 94-95 v6 that was prone to poppin head gaskets i'd say yeah sell it off and get a V8 but his 97 is a perfect foundation for serious HP
a singleport with the 11 psi kit pullied for 15psi 42lb injectors,SCT big air MAF and proper dyno tune along with a good exhaust and rearend with 4.10's and detroit truetrac will put out just shy of 300rwhp and 325ftlbs tq and that is without any engine mods. add RPM BV heads/intakes, 214/224cam or better 1.8 adj rockers and you are in the 340rwhp range on stock pistons/rods. if you are going to go that deep you might as well upgrade to forged rods and pistons and crank up the boost to 20psi or better yet start off with a turbo kit and build it from there.
i disagree with the statement that modding the 6 is more expensive that the 8 for the same power levels. i have both and won't even touch the 4.6 because it is waayyy too expensive to mod it compared to what i have spent on my 6
So here's to ya Cobra232...[sm=icon_cheers.gif]
5th Gear Member
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 3,594
From:
RE: WORTH IT??????????
ORIGINAL: 03YellowPony
Cobra232, for once we are in total agreement. The 3.8 can be modded for a LOT of RWHP. I just don't understand why some people don't understand that. And it doesn't cost as much as some would have others believe.
So here's to ya Cobra232...[sm=icon_cheers.gif]
ORIGINAL: cobra232
wow what misinformation
220rwhp and the 3.8 is maxed out in stock form???
my procharged 98 put down 227rwhp 267ftlbs with an 11psi procharger kit 1.8 rockers dual exhaust and STOCK 14lb injectors with procharger FMU on the first dyno session. it was just getting started. 450rwhp is attainable on a completely internally stock 3.8 and has been done and been proven long term reliable
my 99GT vert only put down 214rwhp 257ftlbs stock.
the ford 3.8 is a very stout block and capable of 1000hp with the proper upgrades. it was an improved modified copy of the stage 1 buick 231. it doesn't have the poor oiling system the buick had nor the usless block skirt nor the crappy shaftmounted easily deflected rockers. it was also an on-center block which eliminated the need for offset con rods like the buick needed. it has heads based on cleveland 2V heads which easily outflow and are much lighter than the buick's iron heads.
what ever can be done to a stage 1 buick it can be done to the ford 3.8 with better results splitport or singleport.
if his car was a 94-95 v6 that was prone to poppin head gaskets i'd say yeah sell it off and get a V8 but his 97 is a perfect foundation for serious HP
a singleport with the 11 psi kit pullied for 15psi 42lb injectors,SCT big air MAF and proper dyno tune along with a good exhaust and rearend with 4.10's and detroit truetrac will put out just shy of 300rwhp and 325ftlbs tq and that is without any engine mods. add RPM BV heads/intakes, 214/224cam or better 1.8 adj rockers and you are in the 340rwhp range on stock pistons/rods. if you are going to go that deep you might as well upgrade to forged rods and pistons and crank up the boost to 20psi or better yet start off with a turbo kit and build it from there.
i disagree with the statement that modding the 6 is more expensive that the 8 for the same power levels. i have both and won't even touch the 4.6 because it is waayyy too expensive to mod it compared to what i have spent on my 6
ORIGINAL: redass02gt
not worth swapping, and I don't think it's worth modding your 6 to get equal power as a GT, because in the end, you'll spend more on the 6er for equivalent power. not to mention that you will be close to maxing out your 6er at ~220whp, which is the starting point of a GT. I know some v6ers have more than 220rwhp, but will you need a built motor to go much higher than that.
not worth swapping, and I don't think it's worth modding your 6 to get equal power as a GT, because in the end, you'll spend more on the 6er for equivalent power. not to mention that you will be close to maxing out your 6er at ~220whp, which is the starting point of a GT. I know some v6ers have more than 220rwhp, but will you need a built motor to go much higher than that.
220rwhp and the 3.8 is maxed out in stock form???
my procharged 98 put down 227rwhp 267ftlbs with an 11psi procharger kit 1.8 rockers dual exhaust and STOCK 14lb injectors with procharger FMU on the first dyno session. it was just getting started. 450rwhp is attainable on a completely internally stock 3.8 and has been done and been proven long term reliable
my 99GT vert only put down 214rwhp 257ftlbs stock.
the ford 3.8 is a very stout block and capable of 1000hp with the proper upgrades. it was an improved modified copy of the stage 1 buick 231. it doesn't have the poor oiling system the buick had nor the usless block skirt nor the crappy shaftmounted easily deflected rockers. it was also an on-center block which eliminated the need for offset con rods like the buick needed. it has heads based on cleveland 2V heads which easily outflow and are much lighter than the buick's iron heads.
what ever can be done to a stage 1 buick it can be done to the ford 3.8 with better results splitport or singleport.
if his car was a 94-95 v6 that was prone to poppin head gaskets i'd say yeah sell it off and get a V8 but his 97 is a perfect foundation for serious HP
a singleport with the 11 psi kit pullied for 15psi 42lb injectors,SCT big air MAF and proper dyno tune along with a good exhaust and rearend with 4.10's and detroit truetrac will put out just shy of 300rwhp and 325ftlbs tq and that is without any engine mods. add RPM BV heads/intakes, 214/224cam or better 1.8 adj rockers and you are in the 340rwhp range on stock pistons/rods. if you are going to go that deep you might as well upgrade to forged rods and pistons and crank up the boost to 20psi or better yet start off with a turbo kit and build it from there.
i disagree with the statement that modding the 6 is more expensive that the 8 for the same power levels. i have both and won't even touch the 4.6 because it is waayyy too expensive to mod it compared to what i have spent on my 6
So here's to ya Cobra232...[sm=icon_cheers.gif]
i have built a few buicks in the past turbo's and non turbo's and nobody ever said why waste time modding a buick v6 when you could just go out and "upgrade" to V8 in a monte carlo. the 3.8/4.2 ford is no different it has every bit the potential and more than the stage 1 buick and will develop power much like a stage 2 buick but the stage 2 buick will handle the power better either off-center or on center stage 2
why more 3.8 ford guy's don't just copy a turbo buick build is beyond me. the buick guy's have done all the hard research for the most part back in the 80's and early 90's. the knowledge is out there to adapt a buick build to the ford.
imo $3000 for a procharger
$800 in fuel/computer upgrades/smaller blower pulley too
$600 in rear
$300 in exhaust
$2000 for heads,cam,intakes
$6700 will get 500rwhp if it is done right
and if you are pretty crafty subtract $2000 for a home built turbo kit and get the same or more power
that's not alot of money to spend at all to get that kind of power. probably one of the best power/dollar engine out there especiall considering you can get a 3.8 stang in good shape to mod for $4000
Retired MF Moderator
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 14,891
RE: WORTH IT??????????
ORIGINAL: babygurl2000
whynot do a supercharger and a 75 shot of NOS too
i mean make ppl think its just a sixer and smoke everything out there on the road
[8D]
whynot do a supercharger and a 75 shot of NOS too
i mean make ppl think its just a sixer and smoke everything out there on the road
[8D]
2nd Gear Member
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 381
From: Englishtown, NJ
RE: WORTH IT??????????
ORIGINAL: jthorn9
Or you could get you GT and dump 10K in it and beat Corvetts, posibly Vipers, and maybe Ferrais.
Or you could get you GT and dump 10K in it and beat Corvetts, posibly Vipers, and maybe Ferrais.
not tryin to be a dick here, but ive valeted all three of these cars you talk about. I valet in a really upscale area where people go out to dinner, and let me tell you there is "nothing!" and I mean "nothing" that compares to the driver seat of the ferrari. I drove the new f430 coupe which is the slightly slower model than 4 years ago but its all aluminum i heard. So just for you info the guy from the fast and furious with the orange **** even with his nitrous would have never cought up to the farrari. The engineeres of ferari work on ten tenths of a second when they tune these cars. Ive also driven the porsche gt down our 30 mph backway ( like i do 30 right...) it feels like civic range for the 430 coupe. The farrari gave me a heache from all of the g's. [sm=headbang.gif] nothing like my dads gto tho, that blew up way back when. sigh..
6th Gear Member
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 15,865
From: Ludlow, Mass
RE: WORTH IT??????????
ORIGINAL: bigwille
not tryin to be a dick here, but ive valeted all three of these cars you talk about. I valet in a really upscale area where people go out to dinner, and let me tell you there is "nothing!" and I mean "nothing" that compares to the driver seat of the ferrari. I drove the new f430 coupe which is the slightly slower model than 4 years ago but its all aluminum i heard. So just for you info the guy from the fast and furious with the orange **** even with his nitrous would have never cought up to the farrari. The engineeres of ferari work on ten tenths of a second when they tune these cars. Ive also driven the porsche gt down our 30 mph backway ( like i do 30 right...) it feels like civic range for the 430 coupe. The farrari gave me a heache from all of the g's. [sm=headbang.gif] nothing like my dads gto tho, that blew up way back when. sigh..
ORIGINAL: jthorn9
Or you could get you GT and dump 10K in it and beat Corvetts, posibly Vipers, and maybe Ferrais.
Or you could get you GT and dump 10K in it and beat Corvetts, posibly Vipers, and maybe Ferrais.
not tryin to be a dick here, but ive valeted all three of these cars you talk about. I valet in a really upscale area where people go out to dinner, and let me tell you there is "nothing!" and I mean "nothing" that compares to the driver seat of the ferrari. I drove the new f430 coupe which is the slightly slower model than 4 years ago but its all aluminum i heard. So just for you info the guy from the fast and furious with the orange **** even with his nitrous would have never cought up to the farrari. The engineeres of ferari work on ten tenths of a second when they tune these cars. Ive also driven the porsche gt down our 30 mph backway ( like i do 30 right...) it feels like civic range for the 430 coupe. The farrari gave me a heache from all of the g's. [sm=headbang.gif] nothing like my dads gto tho, that blew up way back when. sigh..
few links here
http://mustangmonthly.com/techarticl...18/index4.html
http://extremev6racing.com/
EXTREME Moderation
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 7,895
From: BLAM-O
RE: WORTH IT??????????
ORIGINAL: cobra232
wow what misinformation
220rwhp and the 3.8 is maxed out in stock form???
my procharged 98 put down 227rwhp 267ftlbs with an 11psi procharger kit 1.8 rockers dual exhaust and STOCK 14lb injectors with procharger FMU on the first dyno session. it was just getting started. 450rwhp is attainable on a completely internally stock 3.8 and has been done and been proven long term reliable
my 99GT vert only put down 214rwhp 257ftlbs stock.
the ford 3.8 is a very stout block and capable of 1000hp with the proper upgrades. it was an improved modified copy of the stage 1 buick 231. it doesn't have the poor oiling system the buick had nor the usless block skirt nor the crappy shaftmounted easily deflected rockers. it was also an on-center block which eliminated the need for offset con rods like the buick needed. it has heads based on cleveland 2V heads which easily outflow and are much lighter than the buick's iron heads.
what ever can be done to a stage 1 buick it can be done to the ford 3.8 with better results splitport or singleport.
if his car was a 94-95 v6 that was prone to poppin head gaskets i'd say yeah sell it off and get a V8 but his 97 is a perfect foundation for serious HP
a singleport with the 11 psi kit pullied for 15psi 42lb injectors,SCT big air MAF and proper dyno tune along with a good exhaust and rearend with 4.10's and detroit truetrac will put out just shy of 300rwhp and 325ftlbs tq and that is without any engine mods. add RPM BV heads/intakes, 214/224cam or better 1.8 adj rockers and you are in the 340rwhp range on stock pistons/rods. if you are going to go that deep you might as well upgrade to forged rods and pistons and crank up the boost to 20psi or better yet start off with a turbo kit and build it from there.
i disagree with the statement that modding the 6 is more expensive that the 8 for the same power levels. i have both and won't even touch the 4.6 because it is waayyy too expensive to mod it compared to what i have spent on my 6
ORIGINAL: redass02gt
not worth swapping, and I don't think it's worth modding your 6 to get equal power as a GT, because in the end, you'll spend more on the 6er for equivalent power. not to mention that you will be close to maxing out your 6er at ~220whp, which is the starting point of a GT. I know some v6ers have more than 220rwhp, but will you need a built motor to go much higher than that.
not worth swapping, and I don't think it's worth modding your 6 to get equal power as a GT, because in the end, you'll spend more on the 6er for equivalent power. not to mention that you will be close to maxing out your 6er at ~220whp, which is the starting point of a GT. I know some v6ers have more than 220rwhp, but will you need a built motor to go much higher than that.
220rwhp and the 3.8 is maxed out in stock form???
my procharged 98 put down 227rwhp 267ftlbs with an 11psi procharger kit 1.8 rockers dual exhaust and STOCK 14lb injectors with procharger FMU on the first dyno session. it was just getting started. 450rwhp is attainable on a completely internally stock 3.8 and has been done and been proven long term reliable
my 99GT vert only put down 214rwhp 257ftlbs stock.
the ford 3.8 is a very stout block and capable of 1000hp with the proper upgrades. it was an improved modified copy of the stage 1 buick 231. it doesn't have the poor oiling system the buick had nor the usless block skirt nor the crappy shaftmounted easily deflected rockers. it was also an on-center block which eliminated the need for offset con rods like the buick needed. it has heads based on cleveland 2V heads which easily outflow and are much lighter than the buick's iron heads.
what ever can be done to a stage 1 buick it can be done to the ford 3.8 with better results splitport or singleport.
if his car was a 94-95 v6 that was prone to poppin head gaskets i'd say yeah sell it off and get a V8 but his 97 is a perfect foundation for serious HP
a singleport with the 11 psi kit pullied for 15psi 42lb injectors,SCT big air MAF and proper dyno tune along with a good exhaust and rearend with 4.10's and detroit truetrac will put out just shy of 300rwhp and 325ftlbs tq and that is without any engine mods. add RPM BV heads/intakes, 214/224cam or better 1.8 adj rockers and you are in the 340rwhp range on stock pistons/rods. if you are going to go that deep you might as well upgrade to forged rods and pistons and crank up the boost to 20psi or better yet start off with a turbo kit and build it from there.
i disagree with the statement that modding the 6 is more expensive that the 8 for the same power levels. i have both and won't even touch the 4.6 because it is waayyy too expensive to mod it compared to what i have spent on my 6
I ♥ Acer
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 1,641
From: JACKSON,MICHIGAN
RE: WORTH IT??????????
ORIGINAL: nanaki
cause they'd rather not fugger up the engine, snap their rear end, or kiss their tranny bye bye. running just 400RWHP on a GT with slicks you COULD kiss your rear end goodbye.
ORIGINAL: babygurl2000
whynot do a supercharger and a 75 shot of NOS too
i mean make ppl think its just a sixer and smoke everything out there on the road
[8D]
whynot do a supercharger and a 75 shot of NOS too
i mean make ppl think its just a sixer and smoke everything out there on the road
[8D]
i didnt think i needed to state the obvious...
EXTREME Moderation
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 7,895
From: BLAM-O
RE: WORTH IT??????????
you'd have to upgrade the entire rear end, not just the gears. not to mention the tranny too.
anyboyd who doesn't think forging internals, upgrading the rear end and tranny would cost more than a trade in for a GT is either insane or one hell of a bargain shopper.
anyboyd who doesn't think forging internals, upgrading the rear end and tranny would cost more than a trade in for a GT is either insane or one hell of a bargain shopper.
6th Gear Member
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 15,865
From: Ludlow, Mass
RE: WORTH IT??????????
ORIGINAL: redass02gt
you'd have to upgrade the entire rear end, not just the gears. not to mention the tranny too.
anyboyd who doesn't think forging internals, upgrading the rear end and tranny would cost more than a trade in for a GT is either insane or one hell of a bargain shopper.
you'd have to upgrade the entire rear end, not just the gears. not to mention the tranny too.
anyboyd who doesn't think forging internals, upgrading the rear end and tranny would cost more than a trade in for a GT is either insane or one hell of a bargain shopper.
