Oil Change Time
6th Gear Member
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 6,130
From: Honolulu, HI
RE: Oil Change Time
ORIGINAL: buster
I hope its not the first oil change
I hope its not the first oil change
and the same type of oil filter should be ok as long as its a good one, i change the filter every time i change the oil, every 2.5k miles or 4-5 months, it's not a DD and i dont like for it to sit in there too long.
6th Gear Member
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 16,182
From: PA to KY ('07) to IL ('09) to MS ('10) to FL ('11)
RE: Oil Change Time
ORIGINAL: Riptide
OK this might be a stupid question.
If I use motorcraft fully synth 5W-20 do I use the same filter that the dealer used with the semi-synth blend 5W-20?
OK this might be a stupid question.
If I use motorcraft fully synth 5W-20 do I use the same filter that the dealer used with the semi-synth blend 5W-20?
6th Gear Member
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 6,193
From: Montaner
RE: Oil Change Time
I'm still going to change it at 3,000-5,000 miles regardless. Yes I know that is possibly a waste of money to spend all that coin on a synthetic and change it so soon.
Helps me sleep at night.
Helps me sleep at night.
3rd Gear Member
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 707
From: Land of Lincoln
RE: Oil Change Time
ORIGINAL: Riptide
I'm still going to change it at 3,000-5,000 miles regardless. Yes I know that is possibly a waste of money to spend all that coin on a synthetic and change it so soon.
Helps me sleep at night.
I'm still going to change it at 3,000-5,000 miles regardless. Yes I know that is possibly a waste of money to spend all that coin on a synthetic and change it so soon.
Helps me sleep at night.
I have locked into a routine of about 7500 miles...that is just two changes per year for us per car...easy to swallow.
Oh...just had to run out to Wally World and thought I would gander at some "shelf" oil prices. Five quart jugs (full synthetic):
Mobil 1 = $23
Valvoline = $19
Pennzoil = $20
Supertech (WM house brand) = $15
Even the nighest price Mobil 1 is $4.60 a quart...that is HARD to beat! All had legitimate API certified starbursts BTW.
2nd Gear Member
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 317
From: San Juan, Puerto Rico
RE: Oil Change Time
ORIGINAL: illin
My last post on this topic. Again, what I am posting is exactly what happened to me. To claim it is "misinformation" and "a load of crap" is really offensive.
I will answer your questions so forums members understand how worth less the
I never said it was oil...you are jumping to conclusions. If you MUST know it was Amsoil's "universal" ATF. Daimler Chrysler specs ATF +4 and failed to warranty the transmission because ATF +4 was not in use. The analysis was not done at my request, it was ordered by DC. I did answer them straight up, however, that I was using Amsoil when they called and asked.
Amsoil reps (which I assume you are...you did not answer my questions) always claim that the Magnuson Moss Act states that manufactures can not require use of registered oils/lubricants and if they do, they have to give it to you free. Please! Walk into a Honda, Nissan, Hyundai or Dodge dealer and see how many quarts of their brand ATFs (the only ATFs approved for use in their vehicles) you walk out of their for free with.
So to recap...
Amsoil ATF was used in a Dodge van. The tranny was rebuilt (at 12,000 miles BTW) for a cost of around $3300ish.
1. DC refused to warranty the work. This was raised to the regional level and the decision was the same.
2. Amsoil never responded to our claim until addressed via our attorney, then they denied the claim flat out. We did follow the warranty claim procedures to the "t".
3. Amsoil quit communication with us after they denied our claim and just sent us generic "thank you for your inquiry" letters.
So...call it what you want, but there is MY experience with Amsoil. I will never purchase an Amsoil product again and I encourage others to do the same. When I share this story, they question all the double talk and sleazy marketing and make a smart choice by moving on to a quality and certified oil.
FWIW, you story of misrepresenting your blown motor to the dealer is not impressive and is not surprising.
Again, I have no bias here....do you? I strongly recommend people use any API certified oil in their Mustangs. Just about ANY shelf oil is certified oil and will not cause any future warranty issues. For a list of API certified oils check here:
http://www.valvoline.com/pages/products/product_detail.asp?product=6
Your response BTW is a new one (and I thought I had heard them all). All AMSOIL is racing oil and is not approved or recommended for street use? Interesting. It is not marketed as such.
I am done...sorry to the OP for getting off track. My intention is to inform the forum of MY experience with Amsoil and why I firmly recommend that one use a certified oil. Attacking me and my experience does nothing to bolster your side.
My last post on this topic. Again, what I am posting is exactly what happened to me. To claim it is "misinformation" and "a load of crap" is really offensive.
I will answer your questions so forums members understand how worth less the
I never said it was oil...you are jumping to conclusions. If you MUST know it was Amsoil's "universal" ATF. Daimler Chrysler specs ATF +4 and failed to warranty the transmission because ATF +4 was not in use. The analysis was not done at my request, it was ordered by DC. I did answer them straight up, however, that I was using Amsoil when they called and asked.
Amsoil reps (which I assume you are...you did not answer my questions) always claim that the Magnuson Moss Act states that manufactures can not require use of registered oils/lubricants and if they do, they have to give it to you free. Please! Walk into a Honda, Nissan, Hyundai or Dodge dealer and see how many quarts of their brand ATFs (the only ATFs approved for use in their vehicles) you walk out of their for free with.
So to recap...
Amsoil ATF was used in a Dodge van. The tranny was rebuilt (at 12,000 miles BTW) for a cost of around $3300ish.
1. DC refused to warranty the work. This was raised to the regional level and the decision was the same.
2. Amsoil never responded to our claim until addressed via our attorney, then they denied the claim flat out. We did follow the warranty claim procedures to the "t".
3. Amsoil quit communication with us after they denied our claim and just sent us generic "thank you for your inquiry" letters.
So...call it what you want, but there is MY experience with Amsoil. I will never purchase an Amsoil product again and I encourage others to do the same. When I share this story, they question all the double talk and sleazy marketing and make a smart choice by moving on to a quality and certified oil.
FWIW, you story of misrepresenting your blown motor to the dealer is not impressive and is not surprising.
Again, I have no bias here....do you? I strongly recommend people use any API certified oil in their Mustangs. Just about ANY shelf oil is certified oil and will not cause any future warranty issues. For a list of API certified oils check here:
http://www.valvoline.com/pages/products/product_detail.asp?product=6
Your response BTW is a new one (and I thought I had heard them all). All AMSOIL is racing oil and is not approved or recommended for street use? Interesting. It is not marketed as such.
I am done...sorry to the OP for getting off track. My intention is to inform the forum of MY experience with Amsoil and why I firmly recommend that one use a certified oil. Attacking me and my experience does nothing to bolster your side.
Andrew
2nd Gear Member
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 317
From: San Juan, Puerto Rico
RE: Oil Change Time
ORIGINAL: Riptide
I for one was really interested in switching over to Amsoil. Now? Hell no. Not after reading that experience. That's a shame because I've heard people wax on about how great it is.
So we know RP is crap. Now Amsoil as well. If you want to go fully synth what is left? Bah. Screw it. Maybe I'll just switch over to a full synth motorcraft.
Can someone show a link where saleen and roush recommend 5w-30?
I for one was really interested in switching over to Amsoil. Now? Hell no. Not after reading that experience. That's a shame because I've heard people wax on about how great it is.
So we know RP is crap. Now Amsoil as well. If you want to go fully synth what is left? Bah. Screw it. Maybe I'll just switch over to a full synth motorcraft.
Can someone show a link where saleen and roush recommend 5w-30?
. #2 go with motorcraft thats your engine in the long run if you want wear and tear go for it!Andrew
2nd Gear Member
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 317
From: San Juan, Puerto Rico
RE: Oil Change Time
ORIGINAL: Riptide
Interesting.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motor_oil#Grades
This could be true. W/regard to androdz experience has he done an analysis with 5W-30 oil in his engine under the same operating conditions? It's possible the results might not be much better than he got with the 5W-20.
Interesting.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motor_oil#Grades
Many new vehicles are marked to use 5W-20 oil (Honda, Ford, and more recently Toyota) which is not much thinner than a 30W oil. Nay-sayers of 20W oil's ability to protect engines should note that typically, 30W oils shear down into the 20W range anyway. Most engine wear is during start-up and warm-up period, where the thinner 20W oil's flow is desirable. Overall, lab test results of the wear metals contained in used oil samples show low or lower wear with 20W than 30 in applications it is specified for.
Andrew
3rd Gear Member
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 685
From: Chicago (South Loop)
RE: Oil Change Time
The bottom line is, for guys that value our warranty:
Don't use Amsoil, it's not API certified and can cause lots of problems for you if something goes wrong. If your engine fails, don't expect Ford to cover it as using Amsoil voids your warranty.
Don't use Royal Purple, there are many stories of it failing and destroying engines and this oil basically just does not hold up well.
Use 5w-20, not 5w-30. If you use 5w-30, Ford can void your warranty, whereas if you use 5w-20, even if it causes your engine to fail Ford must replace it since that's what they recommend. Yes, 5w-30 might give better protection, and it may be just slightly better for the engine, but Ford apparently saw not enough of a difference to justify the slight decrease in mpg and hp...
===========================================
Basically, that means we should use a 5w-20 synthetic like Mobil 1 or Redline for the best performance while maintaing our warranty.Besides, I would like to keep my warranty, thank you.
Don't use Amsoil, it's not API certified and can cause lots of problems for you if something goes wrong. If your engine fails, don't expect Ford to cover it as using Amsoil voids your warranty.
Don't use Royal Purple, there are many stories of it failing and destroying engines and this oil basically just does not hold up well.
Use 5w-20, not 5w-30. If you use 5w-30, Ford can void your warranty, whereas if you use 5w-20, even if it causes your engine to fail Ford must replace it since that's what they recommend. Yes, 5w-30 might give better protection, and it may be just slightly better for the engine, but Ford apparently saw not enough of a difference to justify the slight decrease in mpg and hp...
===========================================
Basically, that means we should use a 5w-20 synthetic like Mobil 1 or Redline for the best performance while maintaing our warranty.Besides, I would like to keep my warranty, thank you.
2nd Gear Member
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 317
From: San Juan, Puerto Rico
RE: Oil Change Time
ORIGINAL: illin
There is just no way you can go wrong with any major manufacturer's synthetic oil. I will say that Mobil 1 is the benchmark by which all are judged. You can get it anywhere, it is priced well and has a long and proven track record. Moreover, it is API certified.
Here you go. Notice they are ACTUALLY approved:
for 6ers http://www.mobiloil.com/USA-English/...l_1_5W-30.aspx
for 8ers http://www.mobiloil.com/USA-English/...l_1_5W-20.aspx
There is just no way you can go wrong with any major manufacturer's synthetic oil. I will say that Mobil 1 is the benchmark by which all are judged. You can get it anywhere, it is priced well and has a long and proven track record. Moreover, it is API certified.
Here you go. Notice they are ACTUALLY approved:
for 6ers http://www.mobiloil.com/USA-English/...l_1_5W-30.aspx
for 8ers http://www.mobiloil.com/USA-English/...l_1_5W-20.aspx
http://eolcs.api.org/DisplayCompanyInfo.asp?CompanyID=226450'
Please post some direct links I am weary to see some actual proof btw I am still weary of your claim with an ATF because last time I checked ATF Fluids dont have the starlike gold sticker since the gold sticker says "for gasoline engines"
Andrew
2nd Gear Member
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 317
From: San Juan, Puerto Rico
RE: Oil Change Time
ORIGINAL: imyy4u
The bottom line is, for guys that value our warranty:
Don't use Amsoil, it's not API certified and can cause lots of problems for you if something goes wrong. If your engine fails, don't expect Ford to cover it as using Amsoil voids your warranty.
Don't use Royal Purple, there are many stories of it failing and destroying engines and this oil basically just does not hold up well.
Use 5w-20, not 5w-30. If you use 5w-30, Ford can void your warranty, whereas if you use 5w-20, even if it causes your engine to fail Ford must replace it since that's what they recommend. Yes, 5w-30 might give better protection, and it may be just slightly better for the engine, but Ford apparently saw not enough of a difference to justify the slight decrease in mpg and hp...
===========================================
Basically, that means we should use a 5w-20 synthetic like Mobil 1 or Redline for the best performance while maintaing our warranty.Besides, I would like to keep my warranty, thank you.
The bottom line is, for guys that value our warranty:
Don't use Amsoil, it's not API certified and can cause lots of problems for you if something goes wrong. If your engine fails, don't expect Ford to cover it as using Amsoil voids your warranty.
Don't use Royal Purple, there are many stories of it failing and destroying engines and this oil basically just does not hold up well.
Use 5w-20, not 5w-30. If you use 5w-30, Ford can void your warranty, whereas if you use 5w-20, even if it causes your engine to fail Ford must replace it since that's what they recommend. Yes, 5w-30 might give better protection, and it may be just slightly better for the engine, but Ford apparently saw not enough of a difference to justify the slight decrease in mpg and hp...
===========================================
Basically, that means we should use a 5w-20 synthetic like Mobil 1 or Redline for the best performance while maintaing our warranty.Besides, I would like to keep my warranty, thank you.
Quote:[/align] Originally Posted by gmorrell
[/align] Unless you have some oil pressure and temperature data, this starts to become a "Yo dawgs, what's the bestest oil for my Cobra?" thread. No offense intended, but without data, that's where we might be headed.[/align] [/align]Gary-I'm assuming you're not referring to my comments, or don't know my background? Are you aware that I spent about 10 years doing engine development with Ford Motor Company, including being the systems engineer on the 2003 Aviator and 2005 Mustang V8s?
Quote:[/align] Originally Posted by Chim-Chim
[/align] Would you recommend 5W-30, then? I have been running the Motorcraft 5W-20 synthetic blend.[/align] [/align]5W-30 is probably a good oil for the street with mixed temperatures, yes.
Quote:[/align] Originally Posted by GT4Point6
[/align] ?? Not sure what your saying. Are you saying to not run 5w-20 in the mod motors? I wouldn't run it any thinner but 5W20 is the spec oil from most Ford engines since 2001. If there is somehting wrong with it, I'm sure we would see a lot of people with motor problems. Mustangs, CVs, F150, F250-550 and what ever else the put the mod motors in and I'm just not seeing that on the Mustang and Truck forums.[/align] [/align]I think you'll understand that I can go into details here. And understand that I'm not saying that 5W-20 is not going to instantly do damage. But suffice it to say I've seen and been involved in a LOT of development on these motors, and my personal opinion is that I would never run 5W-20 in a modular motor. Regarding your "spec oil" comment, you need to look at what else governs this recommendation.
I apologize for not being a little more clear and forthcoming.
Quote:[/align] Originally Posted by Steve Bassen
[/align] Scott, does your 5W30 recommendation carry over to 5.4L 3V motors?[/align] [/align]Yes. I would not run 5W-20 in ANY stock mod motor. This is especially true in 4v motors, but applies to all of them in one form or another.
Quote:[/align] Originally Posted by Houstonnw
[/align] I'm guessing that you meant to write "I cannot go into details here".[/align] [/align]You are correct. Sorry for the typo. Sometimes I think faster than I type.
Quote:[/align] Originally Posted by Houstonnw
[/align] Steve Bassen asked about the 5.4L 3V motors and I'm interested in the 4.6L 3V motors. I understand that the variable valve timing is based on the engine tolerances and I would assume, the oil viscosity.So if you were taking a 3V Mustang to track days, what oil would you use?[/align] [/align]
My *PERSONAL RECOMMENDATION* would be to run a good fresh synthetic in the 5w-30 to 10W-40 range. And keep an eye on oil temps and oil pressure variations. The oil viscosity might slightly change the VCT's transient behaviors, but I wouldn't expect significant issues. I admit that I've never tested or seen testing relating to oils thicker than 10W-40, so I can't comment on that.
Quote:[/align] Originally Posted by dbower
[/align] Scott: I would be very interested in why you think 5w-20 is a bit too thin for heavy use.[/align] [/align]Because I've seen the dyno testing. I've probably looked at several hundred engines disassembled and spread out on inspection tables. And I've been involved in testing to resolve issues where varying the oil viscosity was part of the test DOE. Trading a very small FE improvement in exchange for a large durability safety margin is not something I'm interested in doing.
For track conditions, I would not trust any OEM or off-the-shelf EOT/CHT correlation. Too many external factors.[/align] __________________
Scott Whitehead
Driver - Rhino Brothers Racing - NASA AIX / AV8SS #63
Ex-Crew Chief - Rehagen Racing - Grand-Am Cup #52, #58, #59
Engineer - Michael Waltrip Racing - NASCAR Nextel Cup #44, #55, #00
Direct link to it: http://corner-carvers.com/forums/sho...607&page=2
So if your naysay has more weight than a person that actually designed the engine well ok go with whatever you want This is a nice quote from the other thread
quote]ORIGINAL: Argonaut
ORIGINAL: Androdz2
Oh you did? did you read my first link? Scott Whitehead one of the engineers that designed the s197 actually states that the 5w-20 was made for cafe standards. Why dont you all just go to blackstonelabs order a free oil analysis kit and do your own oil analysis like some of us have so you can decide if 5w-20 is working(which it wont). The 5w-20 for clearance is primarily 90% false, yes it has tighter clearances but it does not require 5w-20.
Andrew
Oh you did? did you read my first link? Scott Whitehead one of the engineers that designed the s197 actually states that the 5w-20 was made for cafe standards. Why dont you all just go to blackstonelabs order a free oil analysis kit and do your own oil analysis like some of us have so you can decide if 5w-20 is working(which it wont). The 5w-20 for clearance is primarily 90% false, yes it has tighter clearances but it does not require 5w-20.
Andrew
[/quote]
Andrew